Thanks Tabish ji, for your reply
The illustration is not wrong. The upper part if you notice has less density
of hairs as compared to lower part, also they are much shorter in length. In
I. indica hairs if present in upper part are appressed and not spreading as
in I. nil.
I think the reason this thread stetched so long was that if we look at
the synonymy of these two species, they have been much confused in the past.
What we now call as I. indica was earlier I. mutabilis in cultivation, and
many more under different names.
Regarding your reason for including more than one photographers for same
species, it is perfectly alright. My only request to you is that we should
be extra careful when including a differently looking plant. You won't
imagine that when I noticed slightly different Thunbergia grandiflora, I
tried to confirm from different sources, but when nothing helped I simply
put it under T. grandiflora. Only when I saw similar plant here in
California, I relooked at my photographs, luckily chanced upon website of
Hawaii plants, and knew that I had two species with me instead of one: T.
grandiflora and T. laurifolia. Such things only keep the interest in plants
and photography alive.
--
Dr. Gurcharan Singh
Associate Professor, Department of Botany, SGTB Khalsa College
University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018
Phone: 01125518297; Mobile: 9810359089
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/
On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 10:47 AM, Tabish <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Thanks Gurcharan ji, for your detailed reply. So, Ipomoea nil it is. I
> did not know about the feature that the upper part of the sepals is
> hairless - the following illustration then protrays it incorrectly:
> http://malherbologie.cirad.fr/Advenrun/especes/i/iponi/dessin_iponi.html
> Rather I interpreted it incorrectly as sepals being overall hairy.
> Regarding putting up photographs by different people for the same
> species (at FOI), there is a reason behind it. Some species show
> variation in leaves and colors. For example, in some parts, Ipomoea
> indica has heart-shaped leaves, and is some parts, the leaves are
> strongly lobed. Another example is Kydia calycina, where even the
> flower color varies:
> http://www.flowersofindia.net/catalog/slides/Kydia.html
> I feel, putting up pictures of the same species from different parts
> of the country helps, unless of course something has been
> misidentified.
> Best wishes
> - Tabish
>
> On Oct 7, 10:31 pm, Dr Gurcharan Singh <[email protected]> wrote:
> > I completely agree with Garg ji, the plant here is I. nil. The two
> species
> > are often confused but the calyx and folds colour helps in
> identification.
> > The distinctive feature is however, that base of calyx lobes has
> spreading
> > hairs in I. nil, not in I. indica where calyx is appressed pubescent.
> Also
> > the upper part of calyx lobes narrows suddenly in I nil and tip has a
> long
> > acumen. In I. indica the lobes gradually narrow to tip. Also the upper
> part
> > of calyx lobes is more or less glabrous, where as it is appressed
> pubescent.
> > And lastly, and more decisive the colour of leaves, calyx lobes is
> ligher
> > green in I. nil, whereas it is darker and greyish green. So for me it is
> I.
> > nil.
> >
> > Yes Tabish ji, I would request you that you avoid having photographs
> > from two different persons linking to the same species. It can create
> > problem of identity. I had earlier pointed about photographs of
> Thunbergia
> > grandiflora. The one by Aarti Khale belongs to T. grandiflora, but one by
> > Dinesh Valke to T. laurifolia. Here also I strongly feel that photograph
> by
> > Pravin Kawale is I nil whereas one by Thingnam Girija is a different
> > species. I hope you won't my pointing this out.
> >
> > --
> > Dr. Gurcharan Singh
> > Associate Professor, Department of Botany, SGTB Khalsa College
> > University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
> > Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018
> > Phone: 01125518297; Mobile: 9810359089http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/
> >
> > On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 10:01 AM, Dinesh Valke <[email protected]
> >wrote:
> >
> > > Dear Tabish, your justifications have much clarity !! I am capable of
> > > confusing myself !!!!
> > > Regards.
> >
> > > On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 9:40 PM, Tabish <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > >> Dear Dinesh,
> > >> I feel this is not Ipomoea nil, but Ipomoea indica (syn: I. learii).
> > >> The reason is the following:
> > >> Ipomoea nil flowers have sepals which are narrow-linear at the top,
> > >> and suddenly widen at the base.
> > >> The sepals seen in the picture are generally linear. Hairiness of the
> > >> sepals also looks different.
> > >> (actually it is the color of the flower which made me think that it
> > >> may not be I. nil - I have only seen light blue I. nil)
> > >> Please have a look at these two links:
> > >> http://jardimformoso.blogspot.com/2009/01/ipomea-learii.html
> > >>
> http://malherbologie.cirad.fr/Advenrun/especes/i/iponi/dessin_iponi.html
> > >> I would request others to voice their views, as I am not sure on this
> > >> issue.
> > >> - Tabish
> >
> > >> On Oct 7, 8:14 pm, Dinesh Valke <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >> > ... yes Garg ji, it is *Ipomoea nil* ... commonly known as: blue
> morning
> > >> > glory, Japanese morning glory, white-edge morning glory • Assamese:
> নীল
> > >> কলমৌ
> > >> > nil kalmou • Bengali: কালাদানা kaladana, নীলকলমি nilkalami •
> Gujarati:
> > >> કાલા
> > >> > દાના kala dana • Hindi: jharmaric, कालादाना kaladana, नीलकलमी
> neelkalmi
> > >> •
> > >> > Kannada: ಗೌರೀಬೀಜ gowri beeja, kolli beeja • Malayalam: taliyari •
> > >> Marathi:
> > >> > कालादाना kaladana, नीलपुष्पी neelpushpi • Punjabi: bildi • Sanskrit:
> > >> कलंजनी
> > >> > kalanjani, कृष्णबीज krishnabijah • Tamil: காக்கட்டான் kakkattan •
> > >> Telugu:
> > >> > kollivittulu, jirika, కొల్లి kolli
> >
> > >> > Regards.
> >
> > >> > On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 8:32 PM, J.M. Garg <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> > >> > > Taken on 21/9/08 in Hyderabad, A.P.
> > >> > > I thought these to be* Ipomoea indica* till some recent posts on
> > >> *Ipomoea
> > >> > > nil* as below:
> >
> > >> > >
> http://groups.google.co.in/group/indiantreepix/browse_thread/thread/7.
> > >> ..
> > >> > > #
> >
> > >> > >
> http://groups.google.co.in/group/indiantreepix/browse_thread/thread/1.
> > >> ..
> > >> > > Pl. confirm.
> > >> > > --
> > >> > > With regards,
> > >> > > J.M.Garg ([email protected])
> > >> > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1
> > >> > > 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna'
> > >> > > Image Resource of thousands of my images of Birds, Butterflies,
> Flora
> > >> etc.
> > >> > > (arranged alphabetically & place-wise):
> > >> > >http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg
> > >> > > For learning about Indian Flora, visit/ join Google e-group-
> > >> Indiantreepix:
> > >> > >http://groups.google.co.in/group/indiantreepix?hl=en
> >
>
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