Dear Dr Rawat
My compliments on a constructive and thoughtful response re: Soroseris.
I do urge greater collaboration internationally and nationally. This
requiresencouragement at senior levels.
I also recommend, whether in published printed floras or efI data-base that
'difficult'genera are drawn attention to. MOST people consulting such floras
or efI may be completelyunaware that many genera are challenging to identify -
and so even more reason to takemany more good quality close-up images of floral
parts, foliage and fruit (where present) i.e.posting say 10-12 images rather
than just 1 or 2 general shots.
At my lectures in the UK I often speak briefly about PLANT IDENTIFICATION,
saying when Icannot be certain as to which species the plant I am showing an
image of belongs to, that thisis NOT a sign of lack of competence on my part
but expertise. I am aware of the limitations ofmy knowledge and how difficult
(or not) some genera are to name to species level.
I seldom come across, whether in printed floras or guides or on-line, any
indication that an identificationshould be viewed as PROVISIONAL only.
In the UK, I frequently encounter people who THINK identifying plants is (or
should be) a QUICK andEASY process. This is a FALSE assumption.
Also during my lectures in the UK, I state that those who, apparently, can
identify every plant they come across,whether in a garden or the wild, with
consummate ease, do not, know as much as they may think they do!
Best Wishes,
Chris Chadwell
81 Parlaunt Road
SLOUGH
SL3 8BE
UK
www.shpa.org.uk
From: D.S Rawat <[email protected]>
To: efloraofindia <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, 27 February 2017, 7:27
Subject: Re: Soroseris hookeriana - a NEW genus for eFI??
I agree that identification may be doubtful in many cases when no clear
understanding of the species is there.
Soroseris gillii (S.Moore) Stebins was described based on the specimen
collected from Gangotri area by Keshavanand in 1897. Holotype is at Kew and
Isotype is at Dehradun (DD) and I believe authors must have compared their
specimens collected from same area of Gangotri (Kedar Kharak, 4150-4300m) with
easily accessible isotype at DD.
Inclusion of S. glomerata (Decne.) Stebbins in Flora of Gangotri National Park
is based on the Stebbins (1940) who have mentioned the probable distribution in
Jad Ganga valley (4000-5400m) of this park.
Until some revision study the identification based on comparison with type
specimens should be considered closest in my opinion and therefore may not
always require validation by expert to whom specimens can not be sent.
DSRawat Pantnagar
On Saturday, February 25, 2017 at 9:07:55 AM UTC+5:30, JM Garg wrote:
Thanks a lot, Chadwell ji.I do not find any single match in efi site for
Soroseris
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: C CHADWELL <chrischadwell261@btinternet. com>
Date: 24 February 2017 at 18:39
Subject: Soroseris hookeriana - a NEW genus for eFI??
To: "J.M. Garg" <[email protected]>
I do not know which tribe Soroseris belongs to, so may have missed this
genusamongst the listings for Asteraceae on eFI- repeat that I find the
sub-division of Asteraceae(large though the family is) into tribes does not
help me.
I have always operated primarily with GENERA. When I come across a plant in
the UK orthe Himalaya that I do not immediately recognise which SPECIES it
belongs to, I start thinkingwhich genus? Failing that, which family? I do not
think in terms of tribes. I have found very fewpeople think in terms of
families and almost none of tribes.
In the past, both floras and guides (such as Flowers of the Himalaya) were
arranged 'Systematically'by supposedly related families. I NEVER found this
helpful, so rapidly adopted a ALPHABETICALapproach, which I encourage (although
as one can see on eFI) there have been many name changesof families in recent
decades. Nowadays in the UK, very few people learn about plant families or
evenif they know lots of them, think in terms of which other families are
closely-related.
Regardless of whether the genus or species is new to eFI, I doubt if there will
have been manypostings - as like, Fritillaria delavayii, which I have just
posted about, this species is another'high' alpine. Not many botanists or
other members of this group from India have reached suchelevations particularly
if major treks are required.
The image below was scanned in from a slide taken in the early 1990s when I was
working as a consultantto The Royal Government of Bhutan. The pressed specimen
was collected for the mini-herbarium at theNational Institute of Traditional
Medicine, Thimphu on stony slopes at some 4400m on Yak La, Lingshi districtin
July 1990.
Soroseris hookeriana is illustrated in 'Flowers of the Himalaya' recorded on
stony slopes & screes in drierareas from Himachal Pradesh to SE Tibet @
4300-5500m. Is this known from Uttarakhand, I wonder?
Flora of Bhutan records this from among boulders and on screes @ 3650-4720m in
Sikkim, Chumbi and Bhutan.Populations in NE Bhutan and the Sikkim/Chumbi border
do not fit well within this species, seeming to beintermediate between this
species and S.hirsuta.
This flora also records S.erysimoides from Bhutan & Chumbi on screes @ 4-4600m.
The authors observe thatfew populations correspond well with this species.
Some appear close to S.hookeriana.
Such taxonomic uncertainty is beyond the scope of eFI plus I do not envisage
too many formal botanicalexpeditions exploring much in these regions in the
coming years and even if they do, it is unlikely that anyimages will be shared
with this site. So we need not concern ourselves too much with these matters,
exceptto be aware that even the world's leading taxonomists at the top
institutions find it difficult to be certain as towhich species some specimens
belong to.
Best Wishes,
Chris Chadwell
81 Parlaunt Road
SLOUGH
SL3 8BE
UK
www.shpa.org.uk
--
With regards,
J.M.Garg'Creating awareness of IndianFlora & Fauna'Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow
Awards 2014 for efloraofindia.
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