I vote a. I think GPL enforcement is important but don't want to see this become a big money sink.
Tav On Mon, 2015-04-20 at 00:41 -0700, Bryce Harrington wrote: > A majority vote of the current board members is required for the > following Inkscape GPL violation matter. > > Proposal: > > [ ] a. Approve purchase of Digital Fashion Pro by the > Conservancy lawyers, up to $250. > [ ] b. Approve purchase of Digital Fashion Pro by the > Conservancy lawyers, at any price. > [ ] c. Do not approve purchase > > Background: > > Hi guys, > > It's been brought to our attention that there is a company selling > software called Digital Fashion Pro, which in actuality is just Inkscape > with some templates thrown in, and a price tag in the hundreds or > thousands of dollars. It appears they neither mention that the software > is open source under the GPL, nor make offers of source code for > download, which is a GPL violation. > > In order to establish legal proof of the violation, Conservancy needs to > verify the lack of source offer, and to do that they need to examine a > purchased copy of the software. Their policy is to ask the infringed > project (i.e. us) to foot the bill for that copy. If it is found that > the company is in fact in violation, they will be asked (or legally > required) to repay this amount. They may also be required to pay legal > fees, and to come into compliance with the GPL. > > The price of the software has varied during the time of observation. > Currently it is "on sale" for $200, but I've seen it offered at $500 > and even $1500. > > Please see below for the Conservancy's estimation of the likely > best/typical/worst case resolution of this. > > Bryce > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > On 04/08/2015 04:33 AM, Bryce Harrington wrote: > > Before we get too far into this, can I ask a basic question? > > What is the best/likely/worst outcomes we should expect from engaging > > with them on this? > > Probably the best outcome would be for us to find that they already > include a fully-compliant source release of Digital Fashion Pro along > with the product itself, and that they are willing to update their > advertising to make it clear that Digital Fashion Pro is a modified > version of Inkscape (assuming that lack of clarity is one of the current > issues). Even better would be for them to release Digital Fashion Pro > and its source code at no charge, but I don't think this is likely given > that it seems to be a main revenue stream so I wouldn't consider it a > possible outcome really. Another good outcome would be that, though > they didn't ship source initially, they give us a source candidate when > we first contact them and it happens to be compliant, so we charge them > for our time and they pay us. They might even agree to allow us to > write a Conservancy blog post praising them for coming into compliance, > though usually companies don't since they don't like people knowing that > they weren't in compliance to begin with. But if we did get that, > perhaps by giving them a discount on what we charge them for our time > checking their source, it would be very helpful in deterring future > violators and encouraging compliance generally, as people would see > Conservancy is reasonable and willing to work with violators to amicably > resolve issues without public shaming. > > The worst outcome would be that we spend a lot of resources on this > issue and it drags on for a year or more and they're unwilling to budge > so we have to file a lawsuit and we eventually have to agree to a > settlement that offers only the minimum compliance required by the GPL. > That minimum compliance might not resolve the trademark issues, which > we could try to resolve some other way (through a separate action, > possibly also including a lawsuit). "Minimum compliance" would in > practice likely involve them providing source only to people who have > purchased Digital Fashion Pro and who have asked for source. Also, we > may have to keep chasing them as they may then release new versions that > are not compliant. Note that we very rarely file lawsuits to achieve > compliance - this is a worst-case scenario. > > A likely outcome is that we buy Digital Fashion Pro, find that it > doesn't include source code or an offer for source code, and then when > we ask for source, they initially claim they don't need to send us any, > but eventually they capitulate and send us some source code they think > corresponds to the Digital Fashion Pro binaries they ship. We will > probably need to go back and forth with them a few times when it doesn't > build correctly, but we will likely reach a point where they have > provided all the source to us. We'll ask them to include an offer for > source with their product, which they'll do, and provide source on a CD > or similar to anyone who's bought the product and asks for source. This > who process would probably take 6 months to a year. I hesitate somewhat > to say this is a "likely outcome", but given the information I have so > far (see below), it's difficult to provide a more accurate assessment. > > Another possible outcome is that they agree to stop distributing Digital > Fashion Pro and any other software that includes or is based on > Inkscape. This would be compliant, but is also an unlikely outcome > since Inkscape-derived copies of software seem to be one of their main > revenue streams. > > > I ask because I know it'll be a hassle to pursue this, and want to make > > sure the benefits are going worth the effort. I'll need to get > > Inkscape's board to agree to pay for the validation copy of the > > software, so I'd like to communicate to them what outcome we're aiming > > to see. > > Hopefully the above will help with that, though I would emphasize that > it's very difficult to tell where any violation matter might go, > especially in a situation like this where it is extremely unclear how > close to compliance they might be (without buying the software). One > option for getting a better idea without buying Digital Fashion Pro > would be to contact a person who has received Digital Fashion Pro and > ask them whether the distribution they received was compliant - we could > contact such a person for you if you know of one. In any case, we will > probably have a much better idea of the willingness of Digital Fashion > Pro's distributors to work with us after we have downloaded Digital > Fashion Pro and made initial contact with them (assuming it is > violating, which seems likely). We could most likely make this initial > contact within a month or two of us buying Digital Fashion Pro. > > > Let me know if you have any questions about any of this. Thanks! > > Denver > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > ----- Forwarded message from Denver Gingerich <complia...@sfconservancy.org> > ----- > > Date: Fri, 03 Apr 2015 18:15:31 -0400 > From: Denver Gingerich <complia...@sfconservancy.org> > To: Bryce Harrington <br...@osg.samsung.com> > Cc: Karen Sandler <ka...@sfconservancy.org>, Tony Sebro > <t...@sfconservancy.org> > Subject: Re: GPL violation on Inkscape > > On 03/31/2015 02:16 PM, Bryce Harrington wrote: > > Hi Karen, > > > > Guessing this got lost amongst all the GPL violation mail... I know > > you're really busy. Real quick though, is this something SFC might be > > able to help us with, or should we pursue it ourselves? > > Yes, Conservancy can help with this, though we will likely need more > facts in order to take action. I've described what we need below. > > Apologies for the delay in responding; compliance matters like this > are generally handled by me, but I only work at Conservancy one day a > week. > > > On Thu, Mar 19, 2015 at 05:20:09PM -0700, Bryce Harrington wrote: > >> Hi Karen, > >> > >> See email from Maren below. This company is selling a product called > >> Digital Fashion Pro for $1446 (academic price $499), which consists of > >> Inkscape bundled with some training materials and templates. You can > >> see the software is just rebranded Inkscape via their main video: > >> > >> http://startingaclothingline.com/html/pu-demo.html > > There are likely both copyright and trademark issues here. I mainly > work with the copyright issues myself; I've CCed Tony, Conservancy's > general counsel, who has more knowledge of trademark issues. > > To continue with investigating the possible copyright infringement > case (that is, the potential GPL violation), we normally prefer to > have some "hard evidence". To obtain this evidence, we'd like to > purchase Digital Fashion Pro to confirm that it does indeed violate > the GPL (likely by failing to provide source code or an offer for > source). > > I see at http://shop.startingaclothingline.com/ that "1b- Digital > Fashion Pro V8 Basic" is currently available for $199. That seems to > be the least expensive version that's likely to include Inkscape. > With enforcement work like this, we typically ask the member project > to pay any direct costs, such as the $199 cost of buying Digital > Fashion Pro in this case, but we do not charge the member project for > any Conservancy staff time. Of course, we will ask the violator to > pay our costs, including the cost of buying the product (ie. Digital > Fashion Pro), which would then revert to the member project. However, > be aware that we often aren't able to collect from violators, for a > variety of reasons. > > For more details about Conservancy's usual procedures for enforcing > the GPL, feel free to read > https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2012/feb/01/gpl-enforcement/ . > > >> Also, on their troubleshooting page it explicitly references "Free IS.48 > >> Vector Application", which they copy protect with a serial number to > >> unlock it during install. > >> > >> http://startingaclothingline.com/html/troubleshooting.html > > It's hard to say from that page exactly how the serial number is being > used and whether their method would violate the GPL. Since we should > obtain the software anyway in order to check more general compliance, > we can assess the serial number issue once we receive the software. > > >> ----- Forwarded message from ma...@goos-habermann.de ----- > >> > >> Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 22:56:58 +0100 > >> From: ma...@goos-habermann.de > >> To: Bryce Harrington <br...@bryceharrington.org> > >> Subject: Strange Inkscape redistribution - could this be a GPL violation? > [...] > >> You can follow up on this here: > >> https://answers.launchpad.net/inkscape/+question/263166 > >> > >> Also, it is not clear if they offer a modified version or the original > >> software. At least they seem to call it differently. > > This is another fact pattern that we'd like to confirm, which again > would be most easily done after we receive the software. > > > Please let me know if you have any questions at all about any of this. > Thanks! > > Denver Gingerich > FLOSS License Compliance Engineer > Software Freedom Conservancy > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT > Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard > Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises > http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_ > source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF > _______________________________________________ > Inkscape-board mailing list > Inkscape-board@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-board ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ BPM Camp - Free Virtual Workshop May 6th at 10am PDT/1PM EDT Develop your own process in accordance with the BPMN 2 standard Learn Process modeling best practices with Bonita BPM through live exercises http://www.bonitasoft.com/be-part-of-it/events/bpm-camp-virtual- event?utm_ source=Sourceforge_BPM_Camp_5_6_15&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=VA_SF _______________________________________________ Inkscape-board mailing list Inkscape-board@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-board
