G'day Ann, Rowland and the Group
At 06:35 PM 15/10/03 +1000, Ann Wansbrough wrote:
Rowland said:
>
> There's an interesting story in John chapter 8. The religious police
brought
> an adulterous woman to Jesus. He said 'I do not condemn you' (an
astonishing
> statement at that time, which perplexed many early Church fathers) before
he
> said 'Go and sin no more.' You'll meet conservatives who only remember the
> last injunction, and liberals who know only those earlier loving words. A
> plague on both their houses! In our quest to follow Jesus we should put
the
> two together - in his order.
I am perplexed and annoyed at this distortion of the story. The story really
revolves around a third saying: "Let the one who is without sin cast the
first stone", and the report that the group of condemners melted away in
response to these words. To leave this out is to use the bible selectively
and distort the story. The more appropriate conclusion is to recognise that
in the same way as those who brought the woman in adultery could not take
her life away, when challenged about their own sin, so those who would take
away the spiritual life and ministry of those Christians who are satisfy all
other criteria for ministry but are in a homosexual relationship could not
do so if they took seriously Jesus' challenge about their own sin.
I think this is rather tangled logic, but a more serious problem is that by this logic, anyone who applies should be ordained. Say they lack the requisite theological education, no problem. Are there any perfectly educated people to challenge them? Of course not, so ordain them too. Say they lack the personal skills necessary to do that job. Is anyone perfect in this area either? Of course not, so that's not a valid reason for rejecting them either. I like this idea myself, but I don't think the UCA is ready for it. (;->
While on this subject, I can't resist referring to a book I read in the last
couple of weeks about John Wesley's life and ethics. The author (Stone - I
think), made the point that John Wesley thought that the bible said that
women should not preach, but in response to their demonstrable gifts
decided, on the basis of experience, that he should allow them to preach. It
seems to me that that is a useful example to follow on the issue of
ordaining people who satisfy the criteria for ministry but happen to be
homosexual - we should be guided by the experience of their ministry.
I love this story. I have a similar story myself. I grew up challenged and perplexed by Paul's clear statement that he didn't allow a woman to be in authority over a man (I've since had it explained to me, but I did have a problem with it for a long time). It didn't fit my idealism at all. God dealt with me by producing the following situation. A good friend, a woman, was the obvious person to lead our Council of Elders, but was not herself an elder and was not sure she wanted the job. She was suggested to me by others who didn't have her confidence in quite the same way I did, and we were all sure we wanted her to take it on. I helped persuade her to take it. I then found myself nominating her for the eldership. How could I do otherwise? My particular church already had several women elders, and I did not oppose this but I had never previously supported it in any way, quite deliberately.
It was a special moment. The Church and the Spirit both confirmed my decision, but the Bible still seemed out of step with it. This stretched my relationship to God, which wasn't a comfortable experience at the time but good in the long run.
I hadn't heard this story about Wesley before, and I'm very grateful for it. It seems so close to my own experience. Do you know whether Wesley ever resolved to his own satisfaction this apparent (and only apparent) problem with the Bible and women in authority?
And I think you have make a very good and relevant point with it. Perhaps I and others who oppose the ordination of practising homosexuals need to grow and overcome an error we are making. We certainly do need to be open to that possibility.
The point I will make is that such growth will not be produced by polarisation, but hindered.
YiCaa
email: andrewa @ alder . ws
http://www.zeta.org.au/~andrewa
Phone 9441 4476
Mobile 04 2525 4476
****
