> I think we can safely
> put to bed the idea that the designers were dolts who didn't learn from
> history. That doesn't mean there weren't dolts involved in the
> "process".:-)
Bob, actually, why should we put anything to bed? Are you statements
not some "put it to bed, shove it under the carpet" game?
Really -- why not just call them stupid dolts? Why not hold them
accountable? Is accountability suddenly un-American and un-IETF?
The only people who I see discounting accountability (on various
lists) are the ones who either don't understand the scope and impact
of the problem, or are to escape the impact of the disaster that IETF
has thrown at the IPV4 operators who now suddenly face this problem of
IPV6-over-tunnels on the networks they operate. Talk to some
operators. It's no longer DoS. You take your DoS, you IPV6 it, and
voila -- it's DoS x 100, at least. You wait and see.
So, why do we need to wipe the slate clean? Why not should we not
identify the academics involved in IETF who are unaware of the
pushback against source routing that happened in 1992-1995? If people
are unaware if how IPV4 source routing was pushed back against, should
they be at all involved in an any future IETF process that rubber
stamps their kind of bullshit in a "New generation" protocol? If you
don't blame the people who pushed for this crap, who will you blame?
Noone?
Or is the wiping clean of the slate just another retarded IETF process
that will let this stupid mistake be made again, by an IETF that
thinks that the "academic inclusion, uber ales, minus actual code in
use" principle they believe in helps they build things better than
crap?
If I have come to one viewpoint in life it is this:
IF NOONE LEARNS, NOONE LEARNS.
And here I see Bob Hindin (and perhaps some others) making apologies
for his buddies who he personally gave the scope to screw things up
this badly. Bob, you were there. You are one of the dolts.
If IETF has no accountability at present time, now is the time for
accountability. You guys were given a *responsibility* to try to do
right, hell -- the industry and goverments gave you a MANDATE.
Instead you fucked the dog, and my lord, you fucked the dog to death,
and potentially the cat and the canary too.
Bob, I don't know who totally fucked this up; not exactly. But either
the leaders of the process did, or... noone did. And I think we need
to know who did fuck it up, so that they never let their stupid ideas
of process enter into the Internet game again, or the researchers they
listened to (who totally ignore an IETF directive of "security
concerns must be addressed".)
If you were unaware of the vendor and operator push-back against IPV4
source routing, and let this go through, then you are #1 retard of the
century. If you did not, but simply managed researchers who sold you
a bum ride -- you need to say who they were or you are an even bigger
retard.
Yes, I am mean. But Bob, I have dealt with you before and you should
have gotten out of technology a long time ago.
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