Thanks for that Kirk - quite interesting. What do you mean by: "They did so > because management failed to recognized that they needed to loosen the > reigns and let people have access in the same what that others were > starting to do at the time."
A bit more? (smalltalk fascinates me both as tech and as history - I am sure you could talk for hours and people like me would still have questions). On Sep 30, 6:57 am, kirk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm a little late on this thread but being an old Smalltalker I do have > some insight into the problems that lead to it's falling out of grace. I > think there were many. First the old VM technology was much slower than > stuff written in C/C++. Secondly the language it's self is bizzare if > you consider where the vast majority of programmers come from. I know > that shops didn't particularly care for the problems that came with C++. > However moving to something as foreign as Smalltalk just wasn't an > option. Developer seats were expensive and once you picked an > implementation you were locked in. When Java came along it was a natural > bridge between C++ and Smalltalk. C/C++ people could still code the way > they were used to coding. Development shops were also nervous about > Smalltalk coming from a few very small companies. ParcPlace was > vulnerable and that eventually did it in.. just about the time that Java > adoption was starting to take off. So although one might blame Java for > Smalltalks fall, I think it was coming anyways. Sure IBM jumping in on > the bandwagon gave it some legitimacy however.... > > I worked for GemStone for a number of years. IMHO GemStone failed in the > EJB market (even though they had many years of application server > experience in Smalltalk and some time in Java) primarly because they > couldn't make the cultural sift from Smalltalk to Java. WebLogic kicked > "our" asses not because they were better, they weren't. They did so > because management failed to recognized that they needed to loosen the > reigns and let people have access in the same what that others were > starting to do at the time. Again, this is an over simplification. > > Regards, > Kirk > > Hamlet D'Arcy wrote: > > A guy named James Foster just presented last week at a group I belong > > to. His talk called "The Seaside Heresy" was video recorded and posted > > (it's a bit long):http://programminggems.wordpress.com/2008/09/22/video/ > > > He's from Gemstone, but the talk is about Smalltalk and Seaside (the > > web framework). It's very cool to see the edit-and-continue > > capabilities of Smalltalk played out in a web framework. When testing > > your webapp from the browser, an exception puts you in a debugger, at > > which point you can edit the code (not just variable values!), pop the > > stack frame and continue rendering in the browser where you left off. > > Very cool. > > > This is an interesting post about Smalltalk too, called What's Good > > about > > Smalltalk:http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/userblogs/knight/blogView?showComments... > > > On Sep 29, 6:01 am, "Mark Volkmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >> On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 10:24 PM, Mark Derricutt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >>> You can just run squeak in headless mode by added the -headless command > >>> line > >>> parameter. > > >> I've tried that, but haven't been able to get it to work. Can you > >> email me an example command along with the content of an example .st > >> file you pass to the command that works for you? You can send it to me > >> off list at r.mark.volkmann at gmail dot com. > > >> Thanks! > > >>> If you want to connect to this server with a GUI, you can > >>> install the RFB package (Remote Frame Buffer - > >>>http://map.squeak.org/package/d4f692a8-c7fa-4d49-927f-74aba7e8fd83) > > >>> On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 4:08 PM, Mark Volkmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> wrote: > > >>>> The biggest issue seems to be finding an easy way to run a Smalltalk > >>>> application from outside the Squeak environment. It seems that the > >>>> proponents of it feel it is acceptable to have users run applications > > >> -- > >> R. Mark Volkmann > >> Object Computing, Inc. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
