ok, play then :) haven't used either, just scanned them.
but perhaps roo made OSGi more manageable. I say just use spring and enforce the spring modules in your build and you get 80% of the advantages of OSGi w/o all the pain. On Jul 28, 10:01 am, Stuart McCulloch <[email protected]> wrote: > On 28 July 2010 23:31, [email protected] <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > > Complex? Actually Java is a pretty simple language. Ruby/Python/ > > Scala/Groovy all have many more features and richer syntax than Java. > > > The APIs are overly complex. And these APIs set a precedent for > > creating over-engineered super abstract solutions which unfortunately > > most people followed. I mean so we really have to look at everything > > as streams when a string will suffice 95% of the time? Or look at the > > java mail API. Could you make the simple use case of sending a text > > email any harder? > > > Verbose? Yep. I'll agree there..... in making java language > > constructs simple, this resulted in quite a bit of verbosity (no > > properties/events/closures/operator overloading/etc). It was an over- > > reaction to C++'s complexity. Strip the language down to almost > > nothing.... > > > Not productive? I'll agree here too. Java the language is some of > > the problem.... why in 2010 can't I do: String blah = "Hello $ > > {user.name}, your account ${account.number} is assigned.". why can't > > we use String blah = ' "no need to escape my "s! ' and other little > > things like that.... but these are just irritants really. > > The real problem isn't java so much as it is all the frameworks. Ant > > is an absolute abomination. XML is not a scripting language! How in > > God's name did people blindly go down this path of using xml for > > automation/builds? It has led to undebugable build hell, build.xml > > files calling build.xml files calling build.xml files. It has led to > > java trailing all other languages in automation. > > > Other problem frameworks : JSF (xml hell), Axis (ever hear of dynamic > > binding? no, we must generate every stub - your time is not > > important), OSGi (reduce coupling by making it impossible to get > > anything done), Struts (could we have any more layers of indirection?) > > > I still have't found a java web framework I like, so I use rails. But > > roo and play both look promising.... java needs more of this type of > > approach IMO > > FWIW roo is built on top of OSGi... > > On Jul 24, 3:06 am, Blanford <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=10/07/23/1838243 > > > > I have wondered this for years, how Java could be the language of > > > choice for web application design. > > > > Java is so much more complex and unproductive compared to a language > > > like Python. > > > This adds up to time and money. > > > > If I ran a business I would definitely use Java as little as possible. > > > > snydeq writes > > > "Google distinguished engineer Rob Pike ripped the use of Java and C++ > > > during his keynote at OSCON, saying that these 'industrial programming > > > languages' are way too complex and not adequately suited for today's > > > computing environments. 'I think these languages are too hard to use, > > > too subtle, too intricate. They're far too verbose and their subtlety, > > > intricacy and verbosity seem to be increasing over time. They're > > > oversold, and used far too broadly,' Pike said. 'How do we have stuff > > > like this [get to be] the standard way of computing that is taught in > > > schools and is used in industry? [This sort of programming] is very > > > bureaucratic. Every step must be justified to the compiler.' Pike also > > > spoke out against the performance of interpreted languages and dynamic > > > typing." > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "The Java Posse" group. > > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]<javaposse%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups > > .com> > > . > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/javaposse?hl=en.
