> From: Richard Vowles [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Friday, June 11, 1999 1:26 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: JSP versus servlets

> > The major advantage offered by JSPs is the separation of
> programming logic
> > (i.e., your Java code) from the presentation logic (i.e.,
> the JSP page).
> > This is accomplished by coding your application into beans,
> which are then
> > accessed by a JSP page via the <jsp:useBean> and
> <jsp:getProperty> tags.
> > The Java code resides in the beans, where it can be
> maintained separately
> > from the user interface code, which resides in the JSP.

> But you can do the same thing in Servlets (remember, thats
> what JSP is anyway). I believe that the main issue is that
> programming servlets is a pain in the butt.  All those
> annoying out.printlns and the hassle of changing the
> servlet - JSP does it all for you.

If that were all it was, that would probably be a sufficiently
compelling argument (productivity gain & ease of maintainence).
After all, you can do the same thing in bytecode, but nobody
seems to be writing raw bytecode.  (I started assembling Z80
code into hexadecimal by hand, but I don't do that sort of
thing any more...)

It's much more important to separate the _role_ of presentation
development from the _role_ of content development.  In small
shops the two roles might be performed by the same person.
In larger shops, The former is generally performed
by by a HTML-developer type person with no Java skills,
while the latter is performed by a Java programmer with
no presentation skills.  In this circumstance, the fact that
"you can do the same thing in servlets" in not acceptable.

This sort of discussion has been thrashed to death on this
list after the release of the 1.0 JSP draft spec.  I hope
we don't go there again...

> Personally I believe that Servlet programming should be
> pretty much axed and replaced with a model that mixes
> servlets and ejb, but servlets have become to entrenched...

Servlets divorced from EJB have their uses, so axing them is
not a great idea.  However, having the option of using them
in concert with EJB is pretty useful.

Cheers,
        Richard.

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