El Dissabte, 31 de gener de 2015, a les 19:38:27, Jeremy Whiting va escriure: > Albert, Frameworks developers/maintainers, > > On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 12:43 PM, Albert Astals Cid <[email protected]> wrote: > > El Dijous, 29 de gener de 2015, a les 10:05:01, Inge Wallin va escriure: > > > On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 20:47:44 Albert Astals Cid wrote: > > > > El Dimecres, 28 de gener de 2015, a les 14:04:14, Inge Wallin va > > > > escriure: > > > > > On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 07:38:23 laurent Montel wrote: > > > > > > I am agree with Albert if there is a problem with > > > > network-transparency > > > > > > > > on > > > > > > MacOsX it's better to fix it that remove it. > > > > > > > > > > That is not the issue. The issue is that it was promised that if you > > > > > developed your program with KDE Frameworks 5 instead of KDElibs, you > > > > > would > > > > > get a more lightweight program that did not need any daemons to run. > > > > > > > > > > Now this turns out to be not true. *That* is what we want, not to > > > > > remove > > > > > network transparency per se. But if the promise from frameworks 5 is > > > > not > > > > > > > kept, what is there to be done? > > > > > > > > Really? Who promised you that? That's never been the promise, the > > > > promise > > > > > > of KF5 is that it's more modular, and yes there's some libs that don't > > > > need extra daemons and some that do need them. > > > > > > I actually tried to do some research to find this promise in writing but > > > except for pointing it out as a problem in an article on the dot I > > > > couldn't > > > > > find any written promise. > > > > The list on http://api.kde.org/frameworks-api/frameworks5-apidocs/ has > > three > > items, functional, solution, integration. > > > > As far as i remember, functional means you can use it standalone, solution > > means it needs a daemon and integraion means it needs more stuff (more > > daemons? > > Is this categorization correct? Has it been checked with a dependency > analysis to see that each functional framework is usable standalone? I > understood the tiers concept but never did get my head around the > functional/integration/solution concept yet, but would like to. At any > rate, I think KNewStuff which I'm very familiar with doesn't seem to be > usable standalone as the functional status it has implies. It depends on > and uses KIO for all network downloads and uploads, which requires a daemon > as far as I can tell (and is a solution) so should KNewStuff be changed to > a solution also probably?
I see your email did not have much success getting answers from people that know things, you should most probably either change the subject or just send a new email. Cheers, Albert > > > > But I do remember bringing up this problem in a > > > number of conversations with frameworks developers early in the > > > > development > > > > > cycle. One of those times was in a frameworks meeting at Akademy in > > > Tampere. > > > > > > And the developers did say that bringing down the amount of > > > > infrastructure > > > > > that the first KDE application on an alien platform started was one of > > > > the > > > > > motivations for frameworks. Not the only one, of course, but still an > > > important one. > > > > > > > > > And this problem will be in other application. > > > > > > It's not just a problem with kdegames so fix it for kdegames will > > > > fix > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > all application. > > > > > > > > > > > > We can't remove feature each time we need to fix on a specific > > > > > > platform > > > > > > no > > > > > > ? > > > > > > > > > > Yes, it will be in other applications. But that is the price you > > > > have > > > > > > > to > > > > > pay for platform portability sometimes. > > > > > > > > > > I never thought it was reasonable to have to start the full KDE > > > > desktop > > > > > > > infrastructure just to run an application from the KDE on, say, > > > > Gnome. > > > > > > > But > > > > > that's what we had to do back in the kdelibs days. Frameworks 5 was > > > > > supposed to get rid of that but now it turns out that it doesn't. > > > > The > > > > > > > question is: is this just not yet implemented or was this design > > > > > goal > > > > > abandoned? > > > > > > > > What is "the full KDE desktop infraestructure" for you? > > > > > > Let's skip the word "full", since I don't really know every nook and > > > > crannie > > > > > of the kde infrastructure. But to start several daemons to be able to > > > access a file on another server seems like overkill. Even one, in fact. > > > > Why starting a program to do something is an overkill? If i want to > > convert a > > pdf to a ps, running pdftops seems totally legit to me. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Albert > > > > > I understand (or at least I think I do) that kded is an optimisation > > > that > > > loads all the shared libraries once so that all the subsequent kde > > > applications don't have to do it. Instead they are forked off from kded > > > > with > > > > > the libraries already loaded. This is a good idea if you know for sure > > > that you will be running a whole slew of such applications. But this is > > > > not > > > > > a very strong guess on non-KDE platforms and even less so on non-linux > > > platforms. > > > > > > -Inge > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > > > Albert > > > > > > > > > This is what we need to focus on. Network transparency is *not* the > > > > > issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Albert > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers, Ian W. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > > > kde-games-devel mailing list > > > > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > > > > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-games-devel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > > kde-games-devel mailing list > > > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > > > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-games-devel > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > kde-games-devel mailing list > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-games-devel > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > kde-games-devel mailing list > > > > [email protected] > > > > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-games-devel > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > kde-games-devel mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-games-devel > > > > _______________________________________________ > > kde-games-devel mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-games-devel _______________________________________________ Kde-frameworks-devel mailing list [email protected] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-frameworks-devel
