Hats off and a big thank you to Jeff York. What a response !!! Lots of good info in your post. I have saved it to my KR info folder. Thanks also to Larry Flesner. This group is the one of the best resources out there in my humble opinion. I doubt I will trying to achieve a show quality finish and will be happy to achieve a " from 10 feet it looks good" paint job. I have been on this build far too long and want to fly it in my lifetime.
On Tue, Oct 8, 2019 at 12:17 PM <[email protected]> wrote: > Send KRnet mailing list submissions to > [email protected] > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [email protected] > > You can reach the person managing the list at > [email protected] > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: test messagge (Flesner) > 2. Paint (Jim Litchfield) > 3. Re: Paint (Jeff York) > 4. Re: Paint (Flesner) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2019 12:59:22 -0500 > From: Flesner <[email protected]> > To: jeb via KRnet <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: KR> test messagge > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > On 10/7/2019 9:07 AM, jeb via KRnet wrote: > > testing, my email account got archived > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > You got through........ > > Larry Flesner > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2019 15:57:05 -0400 > From: Jim Litchfield <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: KR> Paint > Message-ID: > < > capyzkg6vthzjwhxg+vsrsddqzsefzmvswftd++i5-jhx2xb...@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > OK -- > The net seems pretty sleepy now so I'll post a question. > I am ready to prime the bottom of my project and have been out of the loop > regarding primers/paints for about 20 years. > Can anyone recommend a primer/topcoat combo. > I have friends who swear by Poly Fiber for the pinhole solution but that > stuff is quite pricey and as I understand it is also pretty heavy. > I will probably need a good lightweight high build primer to help smooth my > lumpy glass and of course a topcoat that produces a foot deep shine and > goes on easy (har-d-har ) > Open to all input and thanks for the help. > Jim Litchfield > VBVA > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2019 23:12:24 -0400 > From: Jeff York <[email protected]> > To: KRnet <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: KR> Paint > Message-ID: > <CAKfBJt6JtLm= > [email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > Jim, > > My KR had a nice paint job but had suffered some damage so I repainted it. > To qualify my points instead of giving you an opinion, I have won many > national awards for my KR at Airfest, I have won many awards from my > vintage Airstream Argosy motorhome and it has been featured in many > publications, I have also received many awards for cars, and motorcycles > and the paint in each case was part of the award scores. > > Ok, I am not trying to brag but deeply qualify my upcoming statements. I > have written many articles on the subject of painting a vehicle and the > process and preparation. I have also developed my thoughts on the best > paints based my experiences, quality, finish and durability. > > Ok, this could be a book and I need to shorten this. I should start by a > deep discussion on what might be called body work, pre paint preparation > and methods to get a smooth surface and how to properly treat and prep a > surface for paint. I say this because this is the most important part of > getting an incredible paint finish. But, I think your question is more of > whats a good paint ? Thats a " It depends" kind of answer. ok here goes. > > First let me say this. In paint, you really get what you pay for. Be that > house paint or automotive paint. Let me get to my point. I restored a rare > exotic sports car for my son. The base color paint was $ 1500.00 a gallon. > The clear was $ 700.00 a gallon. The prep work was 2 years and the results > where and still are 5 years later absolutely astounding. > > The paint was s special red Ferrari Testarosa Red made by PPG. It was PPG > Deltron epoxy. Sprayed by me with a Iwata HVLP gun with a 1.3 mm tip. > Pressure at the gun was 45 psi and regulated to 10 PSI by the gun. The > compressor has a 12 CFPM . This is all important in getting the best > results. I do not use this gun for primer. the 1.3 mm tip is for base and > clear coat. I use a Devilbiss HVLP gun with a 1.7 mm tip for primer. Never > use a finish gun to spray primer. > > Now, PPG Deltron DC / DBC is very expensive. I believe base white with no > toners is about $ 600- $ 700 a gallon. You get what you pay for. If you > have seen any of my paint jobs, you will see. NOw let me say this, I dont > do this for a living, I have a regular job. But, I have Oshkosh winners > from Texas to Boston asking me to paint their current projects. I am trying > to simply make a point on the quality of the paint. Honestly, with the > right prep, the actual painting of your plane is the easy part. Add a great > quality paint to your pre paint prep effort and you will get a show quality > result. > > Now, spending that much money is not for everyone. So, my next choice is > Sherman Williams automotive. Its about 1/2 the price of PPG Deltron but a > good quality paint. An expensive quality paint atomizes very fine ( spray > gun also has a major effect on this as does compressors CFPM rate ((needs > at least 9 CFPM)) What you also get in a high quality paint is a paint that > is pure of impurities. Many of those small dirt or specs in a paint job > actually come from the paint itself. > > Now, if PPG or Sherman Williams automotive is more then you want to spend, > then look as Dupont Nasson. You can get a good finish for a fraction of the > cost as compared to PPG. But, it will probably have some impurities. It is > not good for matching exact to existing paint so it is not good for panel > refinishing. > > All the paints I am writing about are all true two part epoxy paints. This > means the are nasty to paint and proper protection of skin and your eyes as > well as a good breathing respirator is required to use these safely. I > suggest true epoxy because you will be painting a composite surface. Paint > bonding is very important and in the case of composites, bonding can be > very difficult because composite curing of the resins will cause a leaching > or expiring of the chemicals that will evaporate out of the material for > some time. Impurities and the curing process are the two main reasons why > paints will de-laminate causing separation. I use epoxy because it prevents > this from happening through the paint and forces the evaporation though the > underside unpainted surface of the composite. I have never had a > de-lamination. > > If you are painting yourself, and you do use a less expensive paint such as > Dupont Nasson, you will most likely be faced with a lot more labor time > color sanding and buffing to achieve that show quality finish. Now, if you > are not going for show quality, then dont spray a two part ( base clear) > and simply spray a single stage paint. I still suggest an epoxy because of > its self etching and bonding qualities. > > Also, use a good automotive wax and paint de-greaser just prior to each > paint coat to get your hand grease and other impurities clean from the > surface and dont touch it again. Impurities such as hand grease is the > number one cause of paint de-lamination and fish eye. > > I suggest wet sanding to at least 400-600 grit sand paper prior to paint > coat. If spraying a two part be, be sure to use a reducer thats for the > temperature range you will be painting at. Also if you are painting a two > part, I suggest color sanding the clear with a 800 wet, then a 1000 wet, > then 1500 wet, then 2000 wet and finish with a 3000 wet. Then I use the > Mcguires line of buffing and finishing compounds. If you have to cut the > clear a bit hard use a # 9 cut buffing and then go to a number 2. If you > can let the paint cure a few weeks before buffing, you will get a much > higher gloss finish. Basically, the longer you let it cure and the harder > it gets before cutting and buffing, the better the results. > > Ok, I wrote a lot and there is a lot more to it. I am always happy to talk > spray painting or many other things like glassing, finishing and so on. If > I can help reach out to me and we can have a far more detailed conversation > based on the type of paint finish you are wanting to achieve. I do do > projects for others from time to time to keep my skills sharp. But, I am > not sure if you are very close to me. > > I hope I helped. > > Jeff York > KR2 > Georgetown Scott County Airport > Lexington, KY. > > On Mon, Oct 7, 2019 at 3:52 PM Jim Litchfield via KRnet < > [email protected]> wrote: > > > OK -- > > The net seems pretty sleepy now so I'll post a question. > > I am ready to prime the bottom of my project and have been out of the > loop > > regarding primers/paints for about 20 years. > > Can anyone recommend a primer/topcoat combo. > > I have friends who swear by Poly Fiber for the pinhole solution but that > > stuff is quite pricey and as I understand it is also pretty heavy. > > I will probably need a good lightweight high build primer to help smooth > my > > lumpy glass and of course a topcoat that produces a foot deep shine and > > goes on easy (har-d-har ) > > Open to all input and thanks for the help. > > Jim Litchfield > > VBVA > > _______________________________________________ > > Search the KRnet Archives at > > https://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/. > > Please see LIST RULES and KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html. > > see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to > change > > options. > > To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to [email protected] > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2019 07:52:14 -0500 > From: Flesner <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: KR> Paint > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > On 10/7/2019 10:12 PM, Jeff York via KRnet wrote: > > If you are painting yourself, and you do use a less expensive paint such > as > > Dupont Nasson, you will most likely be faced with a lot more labor time > > color sanding and buffing to achieve that show quality finish. > > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > While Jeff does award quality work, most of us builders don't do the > quality foundation work on the foam and glass to justify $700 + a gallon > paint.? $700 a gallon paint will not cover up surface irregularities, > bumps, dimples, etc.? I primed my entire KR with the roll on water based > primer and it was painted with the Nasson ($40 gallon 15 years ago) > under a 200 watt bulb in the hangar at 10PM one night.? I have not > touched the paint with wax, a buffer, or sandpaper since the day it > cured 15 years ago.? It doesn't have a 12 inch deep shine but it has > held up well for 15 years and 700+ flight hours.? I used "rattle can" > paint from O'Rileys on the wheel covers but I can't get the gloss from > rattle can paint. Bottom line, If you don't do show quality prep, don't > bother using show quality paint.? You can get? good compliments on $40 a > gallon paint. > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/ir7t6qwsxnqlntn/IMG_0398.jpg?dl=0 > > Larry Flesner > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > KRnet mailing list > [email protected] > http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of KRnet Digest, Vol 7, Issue 242 > ************************************* > _______________________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at https://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/. Please see LIST RULES and KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html. see http://list.krnet.org/mailman/listinfo/krnet_list.krnet.org to change options. To UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to [email protected]
