Alice wrote: I have to admit that I'm still learning about various laces, but my understanding was that 'real' needlelace could not be duplicated by machine. It's made with the buttonhole stitch. Each stitch is looped into the previous row, and interlocks with itself. I don't know of a machine that can duplicate that technique.
Now -- IMITATION Needlelace is a different story. Using the Schiffli Embroidery machine, the **appearance** of needlelace stitches can be produced -- when viewed at a distance. . . . . I must admit that there are some machines that managed to duplicate even the motions and techniques used in some bobbin laces, so other factors have to be considered in claiming the handmade title. But that's bobbin laces, not the needlelace in concern. Woven laces are easier to duplicate on machine than buttonhole stitches. . . . This is all personal opinion -- from someone who is still in the baby stages of learning to be a lace expert. I'm open to hearing from those of you who know more than I do on this subject. After all, doesn't learning something new each day help keep us young? Alice in Oregon --land of rain, fog, floods & more storms coming ===================================== Dear Alice, Fools walk in where angels fear to tread, so, fearlessly I trod. Lace being an endless subject, I don't believe anyone knows everything about it -- certainly not me. But I do agree with you that needle lace by machine with buttonhole stitches is not within my experience or understanding. Like tatting, it has not yet proven economic to make a machine to produce either of these laces, or crochet, now that I think about it. And I think that it will be a long time before anyone does invent such a machine. I looked at the detail pictures and observed: 1: No fluffiness at the edges, or loose threads or raggedness, which are commonly found in the Schiffli imitations, some of which are drop dead gorgeous, just not handmade. 2: Definitely appears the same as multiple samples of this kind of NL that I have seen or are in my own collection. Great workmanship, indifferent design. Only a couple of filling stitches used alternately. Most of all, I can see the stitches. 3: Interesting picots on the bars -- little loops, illustrated in excruciating detail in de Dillmont, i.e. well-known. These particularly would not be picot of choice in a Schiffli rendition, spikey picots would be much more easily accomplished and the actual loop picots are all very clean. 4: The only relief work is the unpadded cordonnets. As is typical, sometimes the cordonnet outline wrinkles a little over time. Again typically, Schiffli work usually does not wrinkle. 5: Fairly coarse thread, which speaks to age or lack of it (in this case). Without holding in my hand and using a magnifier, I came to the conclusion that it was indeed needle lace of fairly recent vintage. To me, everything is in the seeing. Since I look at lace on eBay all the time, I have seen some very interesting pieces. What is coming up more often these days is "point lace" which is the more intricate Battenberg type of laces from the end of the 19th Century when there were not many suitable outlets for middle class women other than needlework. Once the tape is not a simple flat cloth stitch, most people assume that it's too complicated to be anything but hand made. The value of perusing the lace on eBay is that it is precisely the neither fish nor fowl forms of lace that appear there. Museums want letter perfect examples of a lace type, which are rare, lovely and expensive. The lace on eBay is much more quirky, but I find it endlessly instructive. So I agree with Alice, it does look like 'real' needle lace. Patty - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
