If Falcon JS works as described here, it means that OpenLaszlo could utilize the JS generation feature of Falcon JS, as long as the code generated by Falcon JS is not tightly integrated with a Flex kernel written in JS.
On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 6:18 PM, P T Withington <[email protected]> wrote: > That's pretty cool. > > I wonder how their runtime implementation of classes compares to OL's. Since > their compiler can do so much type-checking at compile time, they can > probably write pretty efficient JS. > > On 2011-11-22, at 18:19, Raju Bitter wrote: > >> More information on Falcon JS and the AS3 -> JS transformation by >> Bernd Paradies, the lead engineer for Falcon JS: >> FalconJS is an ActionScript to JavaScript cross-compiler based on >> Falcon, Adobe’s next generation, multi-threaded ActionScript compiler. >>> From a distance, Falcon’s architecture looks pretty much like any >> other compiler architecture: a language front-end parses source code >> and creates an abstract syntax tree (AST), which gets reduced to >> machine code by a code generating backend. In Falcon’s case the >> language front-end parses ActionScript and the backend generates byte >> code that can be interpreted by an ActionScript Virtual Machine (AVM2) >> like the Flash Player. We call that byte code “abc”, which is the >> abbreviation of “Action Block Code” (and not “ActionScript Byte Code” >> like many people think). Most people are probably more familiar with >> SWF and SWC, which are just different package formats for abc byte >> code. >> >> FalconJS simply replaces Falcon’s abc generating backend with its own >> JavaScript generating backend. >> That’s my short description of FalconJS. >> http://blogs.adobe.com/bparadie/2011/11/19/what-is-falconjs/ >> http://blogs.adobe.com/bparadie/2011/11/21/cross-compiling-actionscript-to-javascript/ >> >> On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 9:47 PM, Raju Bitter >> <[email protected]> wrote: >>> The experimental FalconJS product will be open sourced as well. >>> + Falcon, the next-generation MXML and ActionScript compiler that is >>> currently under development (this will be contributed when complete in >>> 2012) >>> + Falcon JS, an experimental cross-compiler from MXML and >>> ActionScript to HTML and JavaScript. >>> >>> So that's the "DHTML" runtime for Flex, Adobe had been workingon. >>> There's little information available on FalconJS, but this blog post has >>> some: >>> http://www.itwriting.com/blog/5132-adobes-falcon-js-compile-flex-code-to-html-and-javascript.html >>> >>> On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 1:10 PM, Raju Bitter >>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> When an RIA platform like Flex or OpenLaszlo is fully controlled by a >>>> single company - even if the source code is under an open source >>>> license - the project still depends on that single company. And the >>>> long-term survival of the platform is not guaranteed. >>>> >>>> Quoting Dirk Kriehle, a professor for open source software: >>>> http://dirkriehle.com/publications/2010-2/the-economic-case-for-open-source-foundations/ >>>> "The main purpose of a foundation is to act as the steward of the >>>> software being developed and to ensure its long-term survival. A >>>> foundation has various responsibilities, including the following: >>>> >>>> + organize the project community; >>>> + actively market the software; >>>> + clarify and manage intellectual property rights; >>>> + set strategic directions for the software; >>>> + respond and remain accountable to its members; and >>>> + run all relevant back-office processes. >>>> >>>> Open source foundations are usually open to everyone to join; however, >>>> a membership fee may apply. Many of their processes are similar to >>>> those of traditional software associations and will not come as a >>>> surprise. What is different, however, is the provision of the main >>>> product as open source and the resulting intellectual property >>>> implications." >>>> >>>> Adobe covered some of what is listed here relatively well, especially >>>> marketing, strategic direction (going from brower-based RIA to >>>> desktops, launching a mobile version of Flash, etc.), responsiveness >>>> to community. There are regular events at the Adobe office in San >>>> Francisco, where you can meet the key developers behind the Flex >>>> compiler, discuss new features, add items to the wish-list, etc. For >>>> Adobe, Flex development is very expensive. With the shift of strategy >>>> away from mainly Flash to more HTML5, the management can not rectify >>>> spending that much cash on an open source SDK any more. If they manage >>>> to donate Flex to the ASF, that's the best option they have in my >>>> eyes. >>>> >>>> Advantages will include: >>>> + sharing development costs for new versions and features within >>>> Flex with other foundation members >>>> + contributing to the platform is much more interesting for Flex >>>> adopters (individuals and companies), since more active contributors >>>> or sponsors can have more influence. >>>> + open source community will be utilized not only for bug >>>> reporting/testing, but will have the chance to actively contribute >>>> features to Flex. >>>> + strategic directions will be controlled by the foundation member; >>>> large companies heavily using Flex (like VMWare of SAP) can be much >>>> more involved with the future of the technology. >>>> + companies and individuals contributing to Flex can be sure that >>>> the value of contributions is not affected by decisions of individual >>>> companies to discontinue a product. >>>> >>>> Check those points against what happened with OpenLaszlo in the past years: >>>> + strategic direction for OpenLaszlo remains unclear >>>> + Laszlo has the last word in which features make it into the next >>>> version of the platform; there's no standardized decision making >>>> process. >>>> + community: no meetings, no interaction between Laszlo and the >>>> community besides the technical communication between the OpenLaszlo >>>> team and the community. >>>> + IP of all contributions go to Laszlo; if Laszlo is acquired, and >>>> the new owner is not interested in the open source project, all the >>>> contributions you made in the past are worth a lot less than they'd be >>>> if the project was independent of Laszlo in a foundation. >>>> >>>> So, yes, I agree with you. Would make a lot of sense to have Adobe >>>> Flex, OpenLaszlo (please choose a better name if it becomes an Apache >>>> project), PhoneGap (check this PhoneGap based OpenLaszlo app on an >>>> Android phone http://vimeo.com/13332562), and OpenMeetings all as ASF >>>> projects. >>>> >>>> Raju >>>> >>>> On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 12:23 PM, [email protected] >>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> So what do you think about it? I don't see the changes that kind of >>>>> negative. >>>>> >>>>> Having an independent Foundation is a big chance for 3th Party vendors to >>>>> be >>>>> part of that project. >>>>> The question "who comes first" or "who is the leader" in such a project is >>>>> actually the question that nobody is interested in ... except the >>>>> management >>>>> teams of the projects. >>>>> And even they should notice that after all negative feeling to be "eaten" >>>>> by >>>>> others that in the end the profit is what counts. And the profit is >>>>> naturaly >>>>> bigger in ONE big project as if your business decisions are affected on >>>>> the >>>>> question "what can we do to compete with Adobe". >>>>> >>>>> In terms of the OpenLaszlo project it would be kind of a re-union of what >>>>> always belonged together ... not only in terms of technology but also as >>>>> it >>>>> somehow feels like 50% of the the folks working at OL have been former or >>>>> present Adobe/Macromedia staff and vice versa >>>>> >>>>> And last but not least beeing native compatible with potential "Apache >>>>> Flex" >>>>> would result in having an update possibility for all existing customers >>>>> .... >>>>> While currently I guess nobody will invest big amounts of $ into a >>>>> technology not knowing what happens in 1,2,3 or 10 years. >>>>> >>>>> Sebastian >>>>> >>>>> 2011/11/17 Raju Bitter <[email protected]> >>>>>> >>>>>> Another update on the Adobe/Flash/Flex developments of the past week. >>>>>> Instead of the Open Spoon Foundation, it's now the ASF: >>>>>> "Given this, we are planning to contribute the Flex SDK to an open >>>>>> source foundation in the same way we contributed PhoneGap to the >>>>>> Apache Foundation when we acquired Nitobi" >>>>>> >>>>>> Should the ASF agree to take the technology, the road map will be >>>>>> managed by an independent governing body operating under Apache's >>>>>> bylaws. Adobe will continue to dedicate full-time engineers to further >>>>>> debug and develop the SDK, the company pledged. >>>>>> >>>>>> Link to the blog post, and longer excerpt: >>>>>> http://blogs.adobe.com/flex/2011/11/your-questions-about-flex.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We know Flex provides a unique set of benefits for enterprise >>>>>>> application developers. We also know that the technology landscape for >>>>>>> application development is rapidly changing and our customers want more >>>>>>> direct control over the underlying technologies they use. Given this, >>>>>>> we are >>>>>>> planning to contribute the Flex SDK to an open source foundation in the >>>>>>> same >>>>>>> way we contributed PhoneGap to the Apache Foundation when we acquired >>>>>>> Nitobi. >>>>>>> What specifically is Adobe proposing? >>>>>>> We are preparing two proposals for incubating Flex SDK and BlazeDS at >>>>>>> the Apache Software Foundation. >>>>>>> In addition to contributing the core Flex SDK (including automation and >>>>>>> advanced data visualization components), Adobe also plans to donate the >>>>>>> following: >>>>>>> Complete, but yet-to-be-released, Spark components, including ViewStack, >>>>>>> Accordion, DateField, DateChooser and an enhanced DataGrid. >>>>>>> BlazeDS, the server-based Java remoting and web messaging technology >>>>>>> that enables developers to easily connect to back-end distributed data >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> push data in real-time to Flex applications. >>>>>>> Falcon, the next-generation MXML and ActionScript compiler that is >>>>>>> currently under development (this will be contributed when complete in >>>>>>> 2012) >>>>>>> Falcon JS, an experimental cross-compiler from MXML and ActionScript to >>>>>>> HTML and JavaScript. >>>>>>> Flex testing tools, as used previously by Adobe, so as to ensure >>>>>>> successful continued development of Flex with high quality >>>>>>> Adobe will also have a team of Flex SDK engineers contributing to those >>>>>>> new Apache projects as their full-time responsibility. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Sebastian Wagner >>>>> http://www.openmeetings.de >>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> >>>> >>> >> > >
