LOL. There are definitely some absurd family trees out there.
John From: CE WOOD Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2018 11:26 AM To: Legacy User Group Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] MyHeritage DNA test And, to top it all off, some dubious genealogies on the internet trace all of us back to Adam and Eve. đ Which, of course, means we all have the same ancestors. Kool-Aid anyone? CE -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LegacyUserGroup <legacyusergroup-boun...@legacyusers.com> on behalf of johnbernac...@iprimus.com.au <johnbernac...@iprimus.com.au> Sent: Monday, January 22, 2018 4:12 PM To: Legacy User Group Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] MyHeritage DNA test Birth, marriage and death records are usually not available from thousands of years ago but I agree that mtDNA and Y-DNA can in some cases provide useful or interesting information, especially if you are very interested in tracing ethnicities and migrations. For example, my motherâs ancestors were from a village at the base of Asiago Plateau in the mountains of northern Italy. I have very strong circumstantial or indirect evidence that those ancestors included people from the very top of the plateau who claim to be descendants of survivors of a tribe of Scandinavian Cimbri who invaded Italy and were almost wiped out 1,000 years ago. They remained quite insular for many centuries and there are still a few who speak the almost extinct language. My DNA supports the other evidence- it contains a lot of Scandinavian DNA and my motherâs mtDNA haplogroup is consistent with it coming from her side of my family. (I will keep trying to find the birth, death and marriage records that may connect me to the Cimbri. Meanwhile I enjoy telling relatives that everything, including DNA, points to us having ancestors from a âlost tribeâ of Cimbri.) MtDNA and Y-DNA can also provide âfun factsâ about your ancestry from many thousands of years ago. The Genographic Project 2.0 provides a âGeniusâ matches with who you share DNA with. The relationships are so old that in one sense it is useless information but it is still fun. I have thirteen such matches from just my line of mtDNA another of Y-DNA. Some examples include: Within the last 12,000 years I shared ancestors with both Queen Victoria and Nikola Tesla. Between 45,000 and 65,000 years ago, I shared ancestors with Abraham Lincoln, Charles Darwin, Genghis Khan, King Tutankhamun and various other âgeniusesâ. Everybody would geniuses in their trees. It is very difficult to get your head around the complexity of DNA, and the more you dig, the more complex it becomes. I encourage everyone to persist in getting a reasonable understanding of how it may or may not assist genealogy research, before you spend a lot of money on it. Genealogy marketers can take advantage of your ignorance. To help guide your research, make sense of DNA and ethnicities, and âput flesh on the bonesâ, I strongly recommend researching the history of your ancestorsâ villages and provinces- invasions, trade routes, waves of migration etc. John From: Ian Macaulay Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2018 9:11 AM To: Legacy User Group Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] MyHeritage DNA test Yes indeed Mongolians in Italy will show as Mongolian. However given two beings and their DNA the comparisons of such will give you information. That information may be of value to you or may not. I have been lucky in that several third party groups have been fascinated enough to explore My DNA lines ( By My I mean our, the DNA Group that I have been linked to), There is a whole branch of science attached to determining the variations in each bit of the DNA, SNP's and determining the time and distance between them. Keeping in mind My poor Friend MR. Denis ( xxxx) who has had only the one hit for the past 12 Years, He has no family through DNA. If your relatives do not go up for testing , you will not find them.via the DNA test. Ian On Mon, Jan 22, 2018 at 4:04 PM, CE WOOD <wood...@msn.com> wrote: Not so. DNA tests do not tell you about thousands of years ago. They match your DNA to what they have in their own database from others who have contributed. If a high percentage of Mongolians happen to now live in Italy, and have contributed to the database, you will be matched with Italy, not Mongolia. DNA misinformation is rampant and disturbing. If only reputable geneticists had the time and inclination to be involved with DNA testing for fun, we would all benefit. âDNA Done Right âŠhow to use DNA in genealogy. There are basically 2 kinds of DNA for that purpose: Y and mt. yDNA is transmitted by the father to his sons and only to them. mtDNA is transmitted by the mother to all her children, but only the daughters will transmit it to the next generation. So what you have to prove is ONE line, not ALL lines. Or TWO lines (from 2 tested to the common ancestors), one for each tested. As to confirm a great-grandparent not in Y or mt line, then it would be by autosomal DNA. At FTDNA, I found grand-parents who compared to their grand-sons. Father vs son: shared 3,384 cM, 267 is the longest block. In other words, we have 23 pairs of chromosomes and 1 of each of them is from the father. For the next generation, grand-son to grand-parents, we have (rounded for privacy reasons) : 1300 to 2000 cM shared, or 40 to 60%. I have not found a ggparent, but it would be 40% of 40% to 60% of 60%, i.e. 16% to 36%. So, for close relatives, we may estimate the relationship, but after 3 generations, you are +/- 1 generation, i.e. accuracy is lost quickly. That said, you won't use triangulation in that context. You can compare people but the accuracy is such that if you want to conclude, you must compare each person and each of their chromosomes, which is so more complex than comparing 2 lines like Y or mt DNA. Anyway, FTDNA stops comparing at 5th cousin, which is too short for any medieval link. Denis [Denis Beauregard, gĂ©nĂ©alogiste Ă©mĂ©rite (FQSG)]â âUsing Y DNA for Medieval Genealogy 1. You do not have to submit Big Y results to Y Full. There is at least one other service that will extract the SNPs, or you can learn how to do it yourself. Everyone in the AS121210 cluster had issues with YFull. They're in Russia. They provide no details about themselves, no phone number, and no contact address, on their web site. Some of us had concerns about the privacy of data. They seem to do good work, but I don't care for their setup or their attitude. What is more, it is plain wrong to do what the haplogroup I project admins are doing, which is getting people to do Y DNA testing and then telling them they have to pay YFull $49 to get the results! Project admins ought to be capable of extracting SNPs from BAM files themselves. There are utilities out there for doing that. Most people doing this work are going to belong to large R1b clades or large I1a clades, not brand new and tiny new branches of haplogroup I1 where little work has been done, like AS121210 - but we've begun to make the effort. We can at least see who shares what, and what we don't share, and then argue about how old that is. It can certainly provide useful information about the relative time when branches branched off. Unfortunately, the first line to split off was probably the Jewish family, and we won't be able to get them to do a Big Y. 2. Someone asked about what kind of DNA testing she would use to get results. I'm not sure what results she wants and that would determine what testing she would use. Mitochondrial DNA won't usually identify recent relatives because it changes over time periods of thousands and not hundreds of years. It can sometimes usefully rule people in and out as relatives or ancestors. For recent relatives, 3rd cousins or closer, who are not of your paternal line, usually one does autosomal DNA. Autosomal DNA can identify, or confirm, ancestors at times as far back as the 16th century, but not at all reliably. At that distance one also runs into the likelihood of sharing more than one ancestral couple, and results that there is no way to make sense of. I keep appearing to be descended from the Rev. Thomas Hooker family. The Hooker family repeatedly lived where my people lived, but.... we'd need better evidence than that if they shared more than the word of God with their congregations. For one's male line, one usually starts with 37 markers or 67 marker STR haplotype at Family Tree DNA. 67 marker is most useful down the road, but sometimes 37 markers yields enough information, especially in the unusual event one has no matches at all at that level. Sometimes people want to know if they belong to a surname group but not where in the surname group they belong. One can do a 111 marker upgrade to see if a common ancestor lived very recently. Unlike the autosomal DNA test it can't specifically identify your father. SNPs come in handy if you aren't satisfied with your ancestral information at that point, or 3. I like the concept of affinity factors. LOL. The surprise that I found when I looked at my AS121210 cluster in more detail, is that London merchants were evidently trading Y DNA along with the furs and wool, and even a financier in the system picked it up. It also wouldn't surprise me if the Y DNA focused on groups who were particularly interested in the settlement of the colonies. I'll drop dead from astonishment if I ever identify a surname behind the cluster, or even a family. 4. I can clearly see that I'm not going to establish the age of this cluster more closely than within one to two hundred years either way. 5. Digging up the ancestor is all of our dream. [SGM, Using Y DNA for medieval genealogy, Dora Smith, 7/30/2017]â CE ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: LegacyUserGroup <legacyusergroup-boun...@legacyusers.com> on behalf of Jenny M Benson <ge...@cedarbank.me.uk> Sent: Monday, January 22, 2018 12:29 PM To: legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] MyHeritage DNA test On 21-Jan-18 07:31 PM, Kevin Ferguson wrote: > The results are rather intriguing and I have no idea how far back the > tests would go back to but as far as I can see the test results don't > match the research I have (I am back to 1780). I find no North African, > Nigerian nor Finnish connection in my direct line ancestors. I agree > with the English portion though :). It is a little bit surprising not to > find any Celtic markers given that my name is Ferguson, my paternal > grandmother was MacDonald and I have documented proof of Scottish kin on > my mother's side. It is all rather perplexing and I have no idea why it > should be so puzzling. My father's ancestors didn't even leave the > county of their births for 300 years! As I understand it, DNA tests which tell you what your ethnic heritage is tell you about your heritate from THOUSANDS of years ago. With all due respect, I don't suppose you have documentary proof going back that far! -- Jenny M Benson https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fjennygenes.blogspot.co.uk%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C59700ab152af47f2583308d561d704ed%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636522498494890355&sdata=K07ScRFekP%2BF6M5DU7%2FnuExh6MyfaQk%2F0L3EovAJS%2B4%3D&reserved=0 -- LegacyUserGroup mailing list LegacyUserGroup@legacyusers.com To manage your subscription and unsubscribe https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flegacyusers.com%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flegacyusergroup_legacyusers.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C59700ab152af47f2583308d561d704ed%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636522498494890355&sdata=ILPbLub327vqOcMP%2FCW6Qv7K413IaH3FFi2VNQ3vlDA%3D&reserved=0 Archives at: https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Flegacyusergroup%40legacyusers.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C59700ab152af47f2583308d561d704ed%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636522498494890355&sdata=jbZWTR6%2B1l9%2Bcq9IkK5UeFPyN25meRbtCb9vuL9dWXM%3D&reserved=0 -- LegacyUserGroup mailing list LegacyUserGroup@legacyusers.com To manage your subscription and unsubscribe http://legacyusers.com/mailman/listinfo/legacyusergroup_legacyusers.com Archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/ -- ICMac Sales: Hobby consultant (1986r.) Office hours: 10:00 Am - 5:00 PM most days Macaulay Genealogy Family Matters Ian Macaulay of Carp, Ontario -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- LegacyUserGroup mailing list LegacyUserGroup@legacyusers.com To manage your subscription and unsubscribe http://legacyusers.com/mailman/listinfo/legacyusergroup_legacyusers.com Archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- LegacyUserGroup mailing list LegacyUserGroup@legacyusers.com To manage your subscription and unsubscribe http://legacyusers.com/mailman/listinfo/legacyusergroup_legacyusers.com Archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
-- LegacyUserGroup mailing list LegacyUserGroup@legacyusers.com To manage your subscription and unsubscribe http://legacyusers.com/mailman/listinfo/legacyusergroup_legacyusers.com Archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
