On 1-Feb-01 at 04:56, Michel Bardiaux ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> Rick Scott wrote:
> >
> > On 31-Jan-01 at 17:26, Michel Bardiaux ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > > Does anyone know about any done or ongoing translation of Scott W.
> > > Sadler's "Motif MDI" C++ classes into C and/or a proper Motif XmManager
> > > subclass?
> > >
> > > And would it be worth doing? I can see several cons:
> > >
> > > (1) In the Open Source world many people hate window-in-window MDI, for
> > > ergonomy reasons or because they hate anything smelling of Windows...
> > > the 2 reasons are not incompatible!
> >
> > Personally, I would like to see this type of interface banished from the
> > planet. What we really need is something that implements a "normal"
> > windowed environment out of any app that tries to confine me to dealing
> > with only their application. And if this is the only way you can figure
> > out to iconify multiple windows when a main window gets iconified, read
> > the man pages!!! Microsoft has some nice features in their interfaces,
> > THIS IS NOT ONE OF THEM.
>
> I thought I *had* acknowledge the repulsion some people have towards WiW
> MDI, so we could go forward and be constructive. But if we must:
>
> (1) Personnally I have used both WiW MDI (Interleaf, Word, Excel) and
> WaotP (window-all-over-the-place) MDI (Island, FrameMaker) and I prefer
> WiW.
>
> (2) To each his taste, the *best* approach surely is to offer a *choice*
> of policy, just as window managers usually offer choice of
> focus-on-click vs. focus-on-move.
>
> (3) One doesn't always have a choice: when you have an application that
> must also run on Wintel and is targetted at non-geek Wintel users, you
> follow Wintel common practices.
> >
> > Let the flames begin, if you must. But I will ignore them, much the same
> > as I ignore the comments that emacs is better than vi (NOT).
>
> I do a few minutes of vi every day to keep in practice. After all, vi is
> the only editor you find on *all* 'nix machines, so, like English, it is
> worth knowing.
> >
> > Recently I have been forced into some development that has to be done on
> > a Microsoft platform, I need to produce a win32 dll. This involves
> > multiple tools that each has its own MDI, each _requires_ it's own editor,
> > and so on. It's a ****** nightmare!!!!! And I consider myself somewhere
> > above the "rookie" stage when it comes to programming, probably not an
> > "expert" but definitly beyond rookie. When I need to deal with one window
> > from "this" MDI, and one window from "that" MDI, you end up with two
> > applications that "assume" they "own" the entire screen.
> >
> > I am however starting to understand why there are so many people getting
> > rich offering "Windows" help, it is so ****** up that you need an expert
> > to explain the screwed up reasoning behind doing the simplest of
> > tasks.....
> > Damn, this is turning into a rant.....I haven't had a good one in a while
> > though.....sorry.....
>
> I had a rant of my own recently on a completely different topic, see
> "Almost giving up" in comp.os.windows.motif. So, I recognize and
> understand the feeling.
> >
> > Bottom line, don't expect any help from me to implement an MDI interface
> > :)
>
> Pity, I'm sure it would have been invaluable. But I'm not asking for
> help at this point, just discussing desirability and feasibility. Is
> your aversion towards WiW so intense an MDI widget would be *banned*
> from Xlt?
No. Like you said, to each his own. It would be nice to have a manager that
gave the choice, either organize all windows inside this one, or at the flick
of a resource make them real topLevel windows. That way one application could
satify us both. I still don't understand why an application wants to be a
window manager as well as an application.
> >
> > >
> > > (2) These classes impose the MWM look-and-feel regardless of the actual
> > > window manager - and Linux has KDE, Gnome, Enligtenment, AfterStep, "A
> > > maze of twisty little WMs, all different".
> > >
> > > The pro, of course, is that there does not seem to be anything else...
>
> Greetings.
> --
> Michel Bardiaux
> Peaktime Belgium S.A. Rue Margot, 37 B-1457 Nil St Vincent
> Tel : +32 10 65.44.15 Fax : +32 10 65.44.10
>
>
