post that you brought up the Laws Of Nations clause as the
Congressional or federal authorization but I don't reamember you
posting that Article 1 section 9 did not give authority, so maybe I did
not pay close attention. I went to the Founders Constitution website to
read the debates and commenteries on the laws of nations, James Martin
had some interesting points on the book Sir Issac Newton wrote on the
subject, he metioned Fracis Bacon and Grotus durning the time of the
Romans who wrote about the laws of nations. Martin spoke about how
natural law and sovereignty and how sovereignty in free states such as
our Republics are ( he used the plural instead of the single Republic
instead of nation) are derieved from the people. He sort of wove
together natural law, sovereignty and municiple law best I remember and
I do know that Switzerland has a strong traditon of the local
government having the say over immigration and naturalzation, it still
exist today and I guess it exist at the time the US Constitution was
first ratified, so local governments if so can have the authority. I'm
not sure if the Swiss communes or local government had that authority
but Swiss federal governments authority has tended to g row over the
years. I heard on NPR that in Germany it is the states not the federal
government that have authority over both immigration and naturalzation
but Germany was not unified as a federation or nation at the time of
the US
founding.
I have not come across to where simply crossing the border withot
permission was a violation against the laws of nation but it makes
sense that it would be. Still does that mean only the federal
government can give permission, Congress can define offenses but if
they define beyound the consept of the laws of nations at the time
then how can it be the laws of nations? Other parts of the
constitution may limit the federal governments authority over
immigration such as the need to get state legislators consent to erect
needful buildings, the due process clause of the 5th amendment, the
just compensation clause of the 5th amendment plus if there is a need
for the state legislators to give consent they can not give it in some
states unless they have the permission of the owners or his or her
representive plus just compensation must be assured by many of the
state legisltors in which the state court judges and juries including
Grand Juries have review over. If the federal government does not allow
property owners alone the border or dockyards to give permission to
immigrants to live and work on the owners property they could be
depriving the owner of just compensation if they don't compensation for
not allowing him use of his property, due process, with state
legislator, state and federal judical review and jury review may also
be in order for denying the owner the use of his property. With the 8th
amendement punishment must be proprational, simple tresspass should not
get the same as someone who damages private fences or is planning to
blow up a city but if an owner gives permission then it would not be
tresspass, so the crime for just crossing the border on to private
property of the owner proprationally must be punished at a lower level
than simple tresspass, it would not be a felony and thus it may not be
in agreement with the laws of nations at the time if it is not a
felony.--- In [email protected], Jon Roland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> The authority to prohibit entry into the country without official
consent does NOT
> derive from EITHER the Naturalization Clause OR the 1808 Clause. It
derives
> completely and exclusively from the Laws of Nations Clause.
> http://www.constitution.org/cmt/laws_of_nations.htm
>
> I have discussed this at length in previous messages. Pay attention.
>
> -- Jon
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> Constitution Society 7793 Burnet Road #37, Austin, TX 78757
> 512/374-9585 www.constitution.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>
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