Linux-Advocacy Digest #655, Volume #27 Thu, 13 Jul 00 20:13:05 EDT
Contents:
Re: Just curious, how do I do this in Windows? (abraxas)
Re: To Pete Goodwin: How Linux saved my lunch today! (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Just curious, how do I do this in Windows? (abraxas)
Re: C# is a copy of java (mlw)
Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it (abraxas)
Re: ## NEW ## MULTITOOL for Linux (Doc Shipley)
Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it (abraxas)
Re: Why use Linux? (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Linsux as a desktop platform ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Just curious, how do I do this in Windows? (David Steinberg)
Re: C# is a copy of java ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it (sandrews)
Re: Are Linux people illiterate? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Aaron R. Kulkis' signature ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Linux lags behind Windows ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Web Browsers? (Bob Hauck)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (abraxas)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Just curious, how do I do this in Windows?
Date: 13 Jul 2000 22:35:01 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Drestin Black <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "abraxas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:8kefaj$3p2$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> In comp.os.linux.advocacy Drestin Black <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>> > Rob:
>> >
>> > I didn't read the code because I have a few questions before I even
> begin to
>> > think about how to do this in windows.
>> >
>>
>> You didnt read the code because you CANT read the code, dresden.
>
> and again, you provide nothing but an attempt at insult. go mutilate
> yourself some more...
>
>
You dont know how to read code, because you are an IT professional. You
know how to hook up printers, and thats about it. Now stop trying to
fool everyone and go back to changing toner.
=====yttrx
------------------------------
Subject: Re: To Pete Goodwin: How Linux saved my lunch today!
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 22:38:29 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Perry Pip) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>And under many circumstances it is. But no OS is best for every
>circumstance everyhere. And where user interface comes into play
>"circumstances" includes the subjectivity of the user. Do you
>understand the meaning of the word "subjective"??
Yes, I understand. I see KDE as something less than Windows desktop because
its different. It has two toolbars and nothing is where I'd expect it to
be. I've been using Windows too long now.
>And there are. There are also many areas where Windows needs
>improvement as well.
Tell me about it. All those reboots just to setup a TCP/IP address! A lot
of controls in Windows 98 are _still_ based on 16 bit controls. Notepad
cannot load a file bigger than 64k (it politely lets you select WordPad,
which uses the Rich Text control, a fully 32 bit control)! Notepad on Win2K
can but only because the controls are 32 bit.
Did you know that multimedia drivers were the last thing to be developed on
Windows, and that they were the ones that could be reinstalled without
rebooting? Well, in theory, as I descovered it doesn't actually work! When
I build a new driver, I reboot, it's the easiest way. Trying to go through
de-install, re-install is a pain.
>And has it ever occured to you that maybe what you find on Linux
>depends directly on what you are looking for, which depends directly
>on what you want? That's what the concept of subjectivety is all
>about. We all see the world thru our own minds and mental filters. And
>as long as you don't understand that, you'll never understand what I
>mean when I say you are being arrogant.
Thank you for that explanation. Rather than the posts I've seen where
people simply call me an ARROGANT FOOL, yours is informative and helps me
understand your point of view.
I see what you're saying. I've been seeing the world for too long in a
Windows perspective (and I resisted MSDOS/Windows a long time as well, I
picked the Archimedes RISC OS until it proved too slow a machine - no
floating point to do raytracing).
I tried the Matrix theme in KDE. Yeehaaa! Although I thought the docking
was a bit naff - it didn't seem to know where the edge of the window was! I
hope KDE 2 is better. Mind you, getting that sort of thing right is a pain,
I had to do it myself.
Pete
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (abraxas)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Just curious, how do I do this in Windows?
Date: 13 Jul 2000 22:38:23 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Drestin Black <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I am not a big fan of C++, Java or PERL - that leaves quite a bit... I tend
> to favor VB (in it's variations) becuase it's easy, fast and universally
> understood and available. And cause I have little time to code like I used
> to.
>
>
>
You dont KNOW C++, java or perl. You like visual basic because of all those
nice point-and-drool programming tools. "Programming" tools.
Uh huh.
You've never actually writen a lick of code in your life, dresden. Stop
pretending you know what youre talking about.
=====yttrx
------------------------------
From: mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: C# is a copy of java
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:39:32 -0400
Gary Hallock wrote:
>
> mlw wrote:
>
> > Obviously, one should end the source module with .cpp or .cc. Are there
> > any environments in which if C is available, C++ is not?
> >
>
> Yes, unfortunately, VM/CMS does not support C++. One of many reasons why I am
> moving from CMS to Linux on S/390.
>
So, not really.
--
Mohawk Software
Windows 9x, Windows NT, UNIX, Linux. Applications, drivers, support.
Visit http://www.mohawksoft.com
Nepotism proves the foolishness of at least two people.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (abraxas)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it
Date: 13 Jul 2000 22:41:03 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Drestin Black <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "abraxas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:8kfke8$18st$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> In comp.os.linux.advocacy Nik Simpson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>> >
>> > "abraxas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> > news:8kefcs$3p2$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >> In comp.os.linux.advocacy Drestin Black <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > wrote:
>> >> > so, your reply to these articles is something to do with google
> needing
>> > such
>> >> > a huge cluster of boxes and your unsupported claim of zero downtime
>> > since
>> >> > inception?
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> The reason that theyve had zero downtime since their linux cluster
>> >> approach is because of "redundancy". I dont expect you to know what
>> >> that means.
>> >
>> >
>> > And if you couldn't get zero downtime out of a 6000 node load balanced
>> > cluster, it would be pretty sad ;-)
>> >
>>
>> And its a defacto victory, such architecture is simply not possible with
>> any version of windows.
>>
>
> ahhahahahahahahahhhaaa bullshit.
>
>
>
Oh really now dresden? Why dont you point me in the direction of documentation
that states that windows (in any form) can lode balance 6,000 nodes, beowulf style.
You'll have to look up the beowulf thing yourself. Though I doubt youll actually
understand it, lets just say that you've your choice of implementations.
=====yttrx
------------------------------
From: Doc Shipley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.linux.sucks,alt.os.linux,alt.os.linux.best,alt.os.linux.dailup,alt.os.linux.mandrake,be.comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: ## NEW ## MULTITOOL for Linux
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 22:41:45 GMT
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> The thought of M$ writing code for linux is scary.
>
They will, man, you know they will. Ignoring the Linux market share is
something that even Ballmer/Gates can't afford much longer.
To a very limited extent, they are. The NFS-testing script that
generated the huge thread a week or so ago DID look like M$ copywrited
work. And as has been mentioned, the Internet Exploder CD comes with a
version "for Linux." I haven't checked that out, but I understand it's a
WINE adaptation.
The thing that's scary about "MS-Office for Linux", etc. is not that M$
might insert malicious code. Although we're not ruling that out ;o) It's
that M$' definition of clean code is so incredibly loose, and their
concept of "nice", in the resource priority sense, is non-existent.
Those 2 factors alone make it hard for me to believe that M$ products
will ever work well in Linux.
--
Doc Shipley
Network Stuff
Austin, Earth
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (abraxas)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it
Date: 13 Jul 2000 22:42:55 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Drestin Black <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> and the basis for your bs is?
>
That the only people who truly like it are "IT professionals".
HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!!!!!!!
Sorry, I said it again. :)
=====yttrx
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Why use Linux?
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 22:47:50 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Perry Pip) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>You said yourself the machine wasn't doing anything. Sorry for
>translating that to American language. I forget you Brits are so
>sensitive :)
I think "shit" has a slightly stronger meaning here.
The machine isn't doing a lot - just serving files, doing the odd FTP
download, or the odd browse for another game demo.
I think what I took exception to was the comment that Windows 98 SE crashes
every month. Period. End of story. No qualification, like how much it's
running etc.
>>Not what? I've installed a ton of stuff on two machines, and neither
>>have need a wipe and reinstall for over a year.
>
>But you said the machines aren't doing anything...why install all
>these apps? It's hard to believe your stories, Pete.
I'm not surprised, I'm getting muddled up myself!
One machine at work is the file server/dead web server. That has had hardly
any replacements.
The other two machines are my home machine and my desktop machine at work.
Both have been running the same version of Windows 98 SE for about a year.
I haven't needed to wipe and restart yet.
>I will concede windows can be stable_in_a_controlled_environment. But
>the real world often does not cater to that.
Yes, I know what you mean. Like, never run too much in case the system goes
p'tang! I run a mail client and one other app. Seems to be stable. Start to
run much more and you might run out of system resources.
I haven't forgotten how at Digital we had huge clustered environments on
room size machines that stayed up for months at end. When desktop machines
appeared, they never got turned off. Windows 98 PCs seem to get turned off
every night, saves electricity I suppose 8).
Pete
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linsux as a desktop platform
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:49:57 -0400
ZnU wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > ZnU wrote:
> > >
> > > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > > > And I'm going to expect that all the software is going to
> > > > continue to function without screwing up because they assumed I'd
> > > > give them a fair shot at the CPU. From there perspective, it
> > > > should look like they're just one of four million other processes
> > > > that want time, right? How prevalent is it for typical programs
> > > > to get "choked to death" by lack of CPU time? And how does a Mac
> > > > manage to run a TCP/IP stack if CMT is so bad when it comes to
> > > > background processes?
> > >
> > > It doesn't use CMT. The TCP/IP stack and several other faceless
> > > background tasks are preemptively tasked against each other and the
> > > rest of the system. Mac OS has PMT features, they just can't be
> > > used by anything that calls the toolbox because many toolbox calls
> > > aren't reentrant.
>
> >
> > ACK!!
> >
> > Why hasn't Apple rewritten them?
>
> It would require app rewrites if Apple did. Carbon
> (http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/carbon/CarbonOverview/index.html)
> is essentially an reentrant version of the Mac OS toolbox, but even that
> won't let you get PMT in Mac OS 9. I'm not sure why, but I strongly
> suspect it's because Carbon itself calls the toolbox under OS 9, and
> Apple would rather require people to upgrade to OS X to get PMT anyway.
OH, god, that sounds SO lame.
The only thing you have to worry about in PMT is race conditions.
Restructuring critical code sections to be guarded with "lock"
flags normally takes all of a couple minutes for most algorithms.
| <http://znu.dhs.org>
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Steinberg)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Just curious, how do I do this in Windows?
Date: 13 Jul 2000 22:52:56 GMT
Drestin Black ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: I am not a big fan of C++, Java or PERL - that leaves quite a bit... I
: tend to favor VB (in it's variations) becuase it's easy, fast and
: universally understood and available. And cause I have little time to
: code like I used to.
Thanks, Drestin, for the best laugh I'll have all week!
<wiping coke off my monitor...>
--
David Steinberg -o)
Computer Engineering Undergrad, UBC / \
[EMAIL PROTECTED] _\_v
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: C# is a copy of java
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:52:37 -0400
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> >
> > mlw wrote:
> > >
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I agree, I see C++ as with just C with a few nice addons. But knowing
> the
> > > > difference is handy when you have program in an environment that
> support C
> > > > but not C++ or if you have to port to one of them.
> > >
> > > Obviously, one should end the source module with .cpp or .cc. Are there
> > > any environments in which if C is available, C++ is not?
> >
> > Apple ][ ?
>
> Did a full C compiler ever get implemented for the Apple ][ or was the Tiny
> C compiler the only one that ever made it to the Apple ][?
>
> The old Apple ][ was far more powerful than the crummy implementation of
> microsoft basic (Applesoft) made it seem. Tasks that would take hours in
> Applesoft could take minutes in UCSD Pascal (Apple Pascal).
I used to hand-assemble C-code, so I know what you mean.
A simple hi-res screen-fill took about 3 seconds in machine language,
but over a minute in Microsoft BASIC.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
I: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: "Jeem" Dutton is a fool of the pathological liar sort.
C: Jet plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a method of
sidetracking discussions which are headed in a direction
that she doesn't like.
D: Jet claims to have killfiled me.
E: Jet now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (D) above.
F: Neither Jeem nor Jet are worthy of the time to compose a
response until their behavior improves.
G: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
H: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:57:56 -0400
From: sandrews <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it
Drestin Black wrote:
>
>
> like the sun boxes we replace often!
^^^
What, do you have a mouse in your pocket??
You said you work for yourself and now claim `we` ?????
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Are Linux people illiterate?
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 23:20:20 GMT
,
> And if people are accepting of some corrections, so that some of us
> that _can_ spell and "gram" (what would be the verb for grammar? :-)),
> so that some of those "presentation errors" can get rooted out, it's
> just _possible_ that we might see documentation that is both:
> a) Useful, which is the _really important part_, and
> b) "Attractively written," which does count to "pointy haired
bosses"
> that don't know the technology and need something else to
criticize
> over.
>
> Some of the HOWTOs _are_ painful to read; I'll only gripe about those
> where the problem is either that the material is:
> 1. Invalid, or
> 2. Tremendously biased due to some underlying attitude that
distracts
> the reader from the real material of the HOWTO. (Some of the
> database stuff suffers from an over-grandiose vision...)
> --
Are you volunteering for the Linux Documentation Proofreading Project?
I for one am grateful for anyone that has *volunteered* their time to
write documentation, a thankless task at best.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Aaron R. Kulkis' signature
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 01:24:58 +0200
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
What does it take to get this guy to stop attaching his rediculous
signature to his posts? Most times the content of his replies are 1 or
2 lines and yet, after many people pointing out that his signature is
far too long, he does nothing!
It's a shame as his comments are normally reasonable and well put.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux lags behind Windows
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 19:31:16 -0400
Pete Goodwin wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Understanding Race conditions is one of SEVERAL reasons why any
> > application
> > programmer (at least those who want to achieve excellance) should
> learn
> > about the process scheduler for the platform on which they program.
>
> Depends on your definition of application doesn't it?
>
> If you're talking a single threaded, single process application, how
> do race conditions even apply?
>
> If you're talking multiprocess or multithreaded processing then I can
> see why race conditions are important, but I still don't see why anyone
> would need to know how the scheduler works.
>
> > > I'm waiting for his response. I'm still waiting. I'm still waiting
> for his
> > > response to the question "Why do I, an application developer, need
> to
> > > understand how the scheduler works?". He never did respond.
> >
> > I already told you: Race Conditions.
>
> Previously you said I would need to know about the scheduler. Now you
> seem to think I need to know about race conditions.
>
> Please expand on what you mean. I can't see that every application
> needing to consider race conditions - which is what you appear to be
> saying.
I never implied that *EVERY* application has race conditions.
However, any programmer who keeps himself IGNORANT of process
scheduling and race conditions is going to step on a land mine,
and NEVER figure it out.
Multi-process simulations.
Let's suppose I'm simulating a battlefield, and, to make the task of
modelling each entity, I have decided to model each unit, weapon,
building, even the terrain, as a seperate processes.
Now...all you have to do is to have each process write to an "input"
pipe or socket of another process which it is interacting with.
Let's say that all messages to the map consist of 3 parts
A) Header (which Process is sending this message?)
B) Map Coordinate
C) Information request (elevation, terrain type, etc.)
or Action (small-arms fire, tank running through building, etc.)
Let's say we have 3 processes:
Process A which is a "target" for the actions of two different
processes.
Process 100 is the map, and listens to pipe /tmp/pipe_100
Process 105 is a unit which is moving, and needs to ask the map
what kind of terrain it is traversing.
Process 123 is another unit which is firing a cannon at some
some point on the map.
Process 123 writes the "preamble" of it's message to /tmp/pipe_100.
Before it gets to the main body of it's message, Process 123 loses
the CPU. In the intervening time, Process 105 writes to /tmp/pipe_100
with a simple request for terrain information at it's location.
Sometime later, Process 123 finishes writing it's message to
/tmp/pipe_100
so, the data in the pipe looks like this:
Data Map process's Interpretation
[Proc 123 process ID header] [Proc 123 header]
[Proc 105 process ID header] [Proc 123 map co-ordinates]
[Proc 105 map co-ordinates] [Proc 123 ?????]
[Proc 105 terrain info request] [Proc ??? header]
[Proc 123 map co-ordinates] [Proc ??? map co-ordinates]
[Proc 123's Cannon-fire event] [Proc ??? Cannon-fire event]
Now...what's going to happen?
Proc 123 is listening to /tmp/pipe_123, expecting the map to start
up a dialogue to resolve the outcome of the cannon fire...but
instead, gets the results of a terrain-info request which it did
not make.
Proc 105 is listening to /tmp/pipe_105....and is stuck, because the
information it is waiting for is NEVER going to show up in the pipe.
Meanwhile, some other process, listening on /tmp/pipe_??? is going
to issue some request to the map (eventually), and the pipe is already
filled with the Cannon-fire event from proc 123's garbled communication.
Someone who doesn't understand the task scheduler is likely to
allow this sort of situation.
Conversely, someone who DOES understand process scheduling will
realize that
a) write(2) is guaranteed to NOT be interrrupted by a context switch.
that is...the context switch will be ignored until the write(2)
requests transfers the data into the filesystem I/O buffers.
b) printf(3) is NOT guaranteed to transfer the output into the
buffers completely uninterrupted by context switches.
c) the use of printf(3) allows the race condition above to occur.
d) the use of 3 seperate writes (proc ID, co-ordinate n-tuple,
and request/event) ALSO allows the race condition above
to occur
therefore
e) EACH PROCESS ***MUST*** scribble it's own output into it's
own internal buffer, and then ***MUST*** use write(2)
to transfer the entire message in ONE PIECE to the
filesystem pipe.
The programmer who is ignorant of the operation of the scheduler
is going to have unexplained errors which he will NEVER NEVER
NEVER understand until he learns about process scheduling.
ANOTHER reason to learn the process scheduler's algorithm is to
prevent processes from suffering from CPU starvation.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
I: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: What I've always said: Netcraft numbers of full of it
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 19:46:07 -0400
Drestin Black wrote:
>
> "Aaron Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> >
> > Drestin Black wrote:
> > >
> > > "Aaron Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Drestin Black wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I've always maintained what is obvious: Netcraft JUST counts domains
> and
> > > > > doesn't discriminate between a linux/apache domain of
> "joesmomma.com" vs
> > > > > W2K/IIS for dell.com - to Netcraft, they mean the same. So, all this
> > > Apache
> > > > > dominates the web is for those that think PURE number counts mean
> > > > > EVERYTHING. Bullshit I say. Someone finally proved it out for me.
> > > > >
> > > > > The companies that matter, those top companies, you know, money
> making
> > > ones?
> > > > > Companies that are concerned about their image, product,
> availability,
> > > > > uptime, performance and all that matters cause their name/image
> on-line
> > > > > matters - they are NOT using apache and MOST DEFINATLEY not using
> Linux!
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > You're kidding, right?
> > > >
> > > > For 5 of the last 6 years, I have worked on Fortune 50 and a stock
> > > > brokerage. NONE of them puts webservers on LoseDOS Neutered
> Technology.
> > >
> > > Care to name it (them)? And, so what, so for 5 of the last 6 years you
> >
> > EDS
> > General Motors
> > Ford Motor Company
> > Kmart Corporation.
>
> name dropping? oh man, there is a game you'll lose with me. I won't even
Don't give me that shit!
You ASKED, you fucking ASSHOLE
> waste time playing. I used to work for someone somewhere, now I work for
Yeah, you're right, you shouldn't bother playing.
GM is only the corporation with the LARGEST Gross Revenue in the entire
world.
> myself, whereever they pay me to and I WANT to. I've seen a lot more than
> you'll get outta a quick 5 years... ha!
Playing on your LoseNT toys?
Not hardly.
>
> >
> >
> > > worked in A company that's a fortune 50 company and it doesn't use NT -
> so
> > > what? Check yourself, do your own netcraft What is it running tests and
> see
> > > who's lying/wrong? I mean, every company I've worked at for the last 8
> years
> > > runs NT without exception - guess using your logic that means I should
> >
> > i.e. companies who's management isn't smart enough to see through
> > Microsoft's lies.
> >
> > Which is better:
> > a) server that run MULTIPLE functions and can stay up for a year or more
>
> wow, like our NT4 servers!
>
> > b) a server that can only do ONE thing (mail, webserving, file serving)
> > and even then crashes every 45 days or less.
>
> like the sun boxes we replace often!
> >
> >
> >
> > > conclude that NONE of them puts webservers on free (you get what you pay
> > > for) apache? silly...
> > >
> > > only 5/6 years? A fortune 50 and a stock brokerage? Is this supposed to
> > > impress me? I've installed at over 40 of the fortune 500 - ever single
> one
> > > NT 4 and now W2K. We push the unix boxes out faster than we can deliver
> new
> > > ones (fortunately it takes fewer new W2K boxes to replace the unix
> clunkers)
> >
> > Obvious lying here.
>
> ha
>
> >
> > fewere W2K boxes to replace equivalent functionality of Unix boxes.
> >
> > What are you pushing out...10-year old machines with 800M drives?
> something from your list of companies you obviously have experience with?
Unlike LoseDOS, "ancient" hardware is quite usable in Unix.
Kmart is currently in the process of upgrading their warehouse
inventory servers from 50 MHz machines each with several 1.6 GB
drives. My understanding is that these machines were originally
installed with HP-UX 8.x. They were not migrated from 9.05 to
10.20 until 1999, and that's ONLY because 9.05 wasn't Y2K compliant.
(Current HP version is HP-UX 11.x)
When I was there, these machines had been in place for over 8 years.
They were so old that when the power supply on a disk drive died,
I had to go out and find a refurbished p/s because HP no longer
covered this model drive under ANY service agreement. (I purchased
a p/s on the company American Express card for $250 and swapped it
myself. HP wanted $750 to walk out the door PLUS time and materials).
The reason they have Unix machines that old still hanging around?
BECAUSE THEY ARE RELIABLE STILL WORK!
You see, in Unix, there is no constant scramble to get the latest
update operating system upgrade as soon as it appears, becuase
Unix systems are stable...and if the system is working fine, you
just leave it alone.
You see, that's the part you LoseNT guys are unfamiliar with:
A system that just fucking sits there and WORKS like it's supposed to.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
I: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: "Jeem" Dutton is a fool of the pathological liar sort.
C: Jet plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a method of
sidetracking discussions which are headed in a direction
that she doesn't like.
D: Jet claims to have killfiled me.
E: Jet now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (D) above.
F: Neither Jeem nor Jet are worthy of the time to compose a
response until their behavior improves.
G: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
H: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)
Subject: Re: Web Browsers?
Reply-To: bobh{at}haucks{dot}org
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 00:00:39 GMT
On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 17:24:22 -0500, Christopher S. Arndt
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I have tried mozilla, but it really take a lot of memory, and is always
>crashing, as does netscape 4.x and 6.x.
Turn off java in Netscape and see if that helps. Also, 4.73 and 4.06
have been pretty reliable for me (even with java).
--
-| Bob Hauck
-| To Whom You Are Speaking
-| http://www.bobh.org/
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