Linux-Advocacy Digest #253, Volume #35 Fri, 15 Jun 01 02:13:02 EDT
Contents:
Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and ignorance...)
("Stephen S. Edwards II")
Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and
ignorance...) ("Stephen S. Edwards II")
Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and
ignorance...) ("Stephen S. Edwards II")
Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and ignorance...)
("Stephen S. Edwards II")
Linux Server Magazine (Robert A Heller)
Reviews of Linux games?? (Rotten168)
Re: Microsft IE6 smart tags ("Erik Funkenbusch")
Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft ("Bill Todd")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Stephen S. Edwards II" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and
ignorance...)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:03:53 -0700
"Rotten168" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Thaddius Maximus wrote:
> >
> > drsquare wrote:
> > >
> > > On Tue, 12 Jun 2001 23:38:54 -0700, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
> > > ("Stephen S. Edwards II" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>) wrote:
> > >
> > > >"Rotten168" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > >
> > > >> Well, let me throw this one at you, how do you feel about the fact
that
> > > >> here in America, somebody under 21 can buy a gun and serve his
country,
> > > >> but he/she can't even walk into a friggin' bar and order a beer?
Where's
> > > >> the American freedom there?
> > > >
> > > >It is preposterous, and such laws are a result
> > > >of the liberal mindset.
> > >
> > > Liberal mindset? How are such draconian laws liberal?
> > >
> > > >That law was as recent
> > > >as the 70's, IIRC. The reason why laws like
> > > >that one get put into place is because of
> > > >a lack of patriotism, and pride. People just
> > > >apathetically allow these idiotic politicians
> > > >to do their own bidding, without saying a damn
> > > >word.
> > >
> > > Well, that's democracy for you. If I was the absolute dictator of the
> > > world, such things would never happen.
> > >
> >
> > For the last time - the USA is NOT a democracy and has never been a
> > democracy. The USA is a republic!
>
> *sigh* I swear to God I've had to pull out Webster's every damn time I
> get involved in a flame war on USENET.
>
> Ahem.
>
> democracy n. 1. government by the people, either directly or through
> representatives
>
> republic n. a state or government in which the supreme power rests in
> all the citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by representatives
> elected by them
>
> I'd say either or both would apply.
I agree. I think it would be more accurate
to say that it is a republic, that has a
democratic election and legislation process.
------------------------------
From: "Stephen S. Edwards II" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and
ignorance...)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:11:13 -0700
"Rotten168" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> "Stephen S. Edwards II" wrote:
>
> > Did you know that out here in AZ, we actually had a Rep.
> > advocating the idea of having a "state dirt"? I couldn't
> > believe that one. Another case of a pot-smoking lib
> > dressing like a Rep, IMHO.
>
> What's your beef with pot?
I've seen it turn too many of my friends
into losers.
I've heard all of the arguments:
"Pot isn't a drug, it's an herb!"
Of course, they would get mad when
I mentioned penecillin (sp?).
"Pot relaxes you, and makes you
more aware of your surroundings."
Like when four of the idiots were
in a serious car accident because
they were too damned stoned to notice
the road actually had a turn or two
in it.
"Pot has valid medical benefits."
Pain relief. That can be had with
morphine, or codien (sp?), or
perkaset (sp?). If it can relieve
glaucoma, then extract the necessary
portion of it, and put it in a fucking
pill for Christ's sake!
This is a bunch of B.S. I've had
a bunch of friends who smoked pot
in college... to this day, they
still do, and are nothing but
useless ne'er do wells.
I will never think that pot is a
good thing, especially in light of the
fact that it was recently discovered
that marijuana causes tumors in brain
tissue after years of extended use.
Yes, my beef is personal.
------------------------------
From: "Stephen S. Edwards II" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and
ignorance...)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:12:02 -0700
"Rotten168" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> "Matthew Gardiner (BOFH)" wrote:
> >
> > >>I don't think he's referring to the current state, or the
> > >>way things were way back when. I think he's referring to
> > >>the ideas and ideals that are genius. In such a case, I
> > >>would agree, to the logical extent that such ways are the
> > >>most realistic ideals to date.
> > >>
> > >>It is my contention that most politicians, be they
> > >>Democrat, or Republican, are fscking morons. Look
> > >>at how McCain has been waffling along. IMHO, Bush
> > >>just happens to be one of the few exceptions to the
> > >>rule.
> > >>
> > >>Did you know that out here in AZ, we actually had a Rep.
> > >>advocating the idea of having a "state dirt"? I couldn't
> > >>believe that one. Another case of a pot-smoking lib
> > >>dressing like a Rep, IMHO.
> > >>
> > >
> > > I just think that McCaine has a grudge against bush.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > I remember, when Bill Clinton went for his second term, there was a dim
> > witt who wanted to close the US up, vitually make it an eastern block
> > because "foreign competition was taking jobs away from US citizens".
> >
> > Someone should have really smacked the guy in the head with a reality
stick.
> >
> > Matthew Gardiner
>
> I think you're talking about Buchanan. Yes, the man is a clown... no one
> took him seriously, don't worry.
Clown? Maybe. Racist scum is more like it. It's
idiots like Buchanan that put mainstream conservatives
in the shithouse with Americans for so many years.
------------------------------
From: "Stephen S. Edwards II" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: OT: Where is American pride?... (was Re: European arrogance and
ignorance...)
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:24:41 -0700
"Rotten168" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Edward Rosten wrote:
> >
> > >> I have a growing suspicion that you don't know what the word
"liberal"
> > >> means.
> > >
> > > I have a growing suspicion that you don't know who liberals are.
> >
> > You have absoloutely no idea what liberals are about. You seem to think
> > it is some passive middleground adopted by people who have no forceful
> > opinions. You are completely wrong.
> >
> > -Ed
>
> I think that the simple fact of the matter is that there are many
> contradictory definitions of 'liberal' and they are all right.
>
> Conservatives use the word 'liberal' to refer to lefties here in
> America. I'm not sure how or why that started but it stuck. I think that
> the early liberals where romantic, emotional, dramatic... and despised
> by the federalist conservatives (Jefferson was an early liberal). I
> suppose that may be why, considering the philistine nature of
> contemporary conservatives.
>
> It's fair to say that the textbook definition of liberal is more akin to
> a libertarian in the contemporary world... people who believe in as
> little government intervention as humanly possible. There was a famous
If that is the textbook definition, then
I would say it's quite erroneous.
It is conservatives who want smaller government,
so that the market can drive the economy more
efficiently. Also, the conservative belief is
that corporations and individuals should meet
needs by solving problems themselves, without
the intervention of the govt. The govt. should
provide help, yes, but only to people who
legitimately cannot take care of themselves.
Ala, Bush's push for tax breaks. People
looking for a free ride should be in poverty,
IMHO. I have no interest in allowing the
govt to force me to hand over my dollars
to a group of losers who are too lazy to
work. Most people who are poor, are poor
because they are addicted to drugs, or
they have gotten used to getting money
from Uncle Sam, and have no desire to
work... why should they, when they can
get a free ride at our expense?
I have never met anyone who worked their
asses off, and failed in life. My father
is my easiest example. He busted his
rear for three years after he quit his
job at Honeywell, and he built his own
business, with no help from anyone or
anything but me, sis, Mom, and his own
wits. We lived on franks and beans for
quite some time, but it all paid off.
Even Bill Gates started off with virtually
nothing to his name.
It is the liberals who wish to use govt. as
a tool of "protection"... to save people from
themselves... this means bigger govt, in the end.
Most of the liberals in the American populous
are well-intentioned... they are merely buying
into the lies that the libDems have been spewing
in order to keep themselves in office, and rolling
in green stuff.
Funding for public schools, funding for nutcase
eco-terrorist programs, funding for medicare,
funding for welfare, etc. These are all govt
programs that suck up people's incomes, and
make the govt much larger than it needs to be.
Conservatives want to end that... now.
If you look at all of the goverment programs started
in the last six years or so, you'll notice that they
were nearly all liberal Democratic initiatives.
Conservatives are hard-nosed, and we are also
confrontational, and competitive. This is
because we believe that this is the essence
of life... competition makes everyone stronger,
and everyone wins as a result.
> article by a libertarian which was entitled "Why I am not a
> conservative"... he objected to the term 'conservative' because he
> wanted things to change.
Sounds like he's bought into the demonization
the conReps have had to endure all these years.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 22:48:30 -0700
From: Robert A Heller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Linux Server Magazine
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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rated Communicado FAX 4 from www.merlinsoftech.com as easy to use as MS
Windows based software.
It certainly seems to work well, at least the PE version does.
==============A3A659ED53B9D9C28A5F56AC
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==============A3A659ED53B9D9C28A5F56AC==
------------------------------
From: Rotten168 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Reviews of Linux games??
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 05:55:01 GMT
Any good sites where I can find good, objective reviews of Linux games?
And nothing with that damned penguin either! =^)
BTW anyone try the Linux port of SMAC? It's supposed to be one of the
best ports I guess.
--
- Brent
"General Veer, prepare your underpants for ground assault."
- Darth Vader
http://rotten168.home.att.net
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Microsft IE6 smart tags
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 01:06:30 -0500
"GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> >
> > "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> > > >
> > > > "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > >
> >
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > > Jon Johansan wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "Peter K�hlmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > > > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > > > > T. Max Devlin wrote:
> > > > > > > > Said Ayende Rahien in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sun, 10 Jun
2001
> > > > 14:08:35
> > > > > > > >>Actually, the reason I want net worth is to find things out
> > about
> > > > other
> > > > > > > >>companies.
> > > > > > > >>I sometimes post stuff that would be much more interesting
if I
> > > > could
> > > > > > add
> > > > > > > >>small tidbits like, "X could buy Y for pocket change".
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Actually, Ayende, if you don't mind the advice, it would
just
> > make
> > > > you
> > > > > > > > look foolish.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > No, TMax, the one person looking foolish is you.
> > > > > > > Ayende is advocating Windows, and he has reasons to do it.
> > > > > > > You may find those reasons invalid, but he does it in a quite
> > pleasant
> > > > > > > way, very different from Chad Myers and Jon Johanson.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Pleasant or not pleasant (from your point of view) doesn't
> > invalidate
> > > > things
> > > > > > Chad or I may say. I don't think I'm unpleasant but I realize
that I
> > am
> > > > > > saying things that people who hate MS and it's products won't
like
> > to
> > > > hear.
> > > > > > And sometimes I put linux down too and that would be unpleasant
to
> > those
> > > > > > that love it. But, again, that doesn't invalidate the facts.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > He actually knows what he is talking about.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I take offense at that however, I do know what I'm talking
about -
> > you
> > > > may
> > > > > > just not like what you hear...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > You, on the other hand, tell us all how vastly superior linux
is
> > > > compared
> > > > > > > to the stuff MS sells. Yet you do not use linux, you use
windows.
> > > > > > > Seems to be a little contradiction, doesn�t it?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So why not fling your "unpleasant" comments at him then? At
least we
> > use
> > > > the
> > > > > > products we advocate religiously.
> > > > >
> > > > > Hey, when is MS gonna fix VC6.0??
> > > > > I've been waiting for over a year and still no fixes.
> > > >
> > > > Are you not aware of the 5 service packs? SP5 was released about 6
> > months
> > > > ago.
> > >
> > > No... which link to download these service packs. I'd hate to throw
> > > away my investment and start over with Metrowerks tools.
> >
> > You can find most things at the Visual C++ web page at
> > http://msdn.microsoft.com/visualc/
> >
> > Under "Product Support" choose "Product Updates".
>
> I've already tried. Product is too old for them to update and I can't
> download 175Mb of sp5 down over a 28.8 link. I was even willing to
> spend a mere $5 on a CD and MS refused because I didn't renew my msdn
> subscription. I will move over to Metrowerks in due time as its found
> on a lot of different platforms.
Huh? You get the service packs free with MSDN, you only have to pay the $5
if you're not an MSDN member. That makes no sense.
------------------------------
From: "Bill Todd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.arch,misc.invest.stocks
Subject: Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:12:10 -0400
"Maynard Handley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
...
> I think the resolution we are coming to is that the way to do this in
> pretty much any situation (Win/Mac/UNIX) is
> (a) get the material from old machine to new (if necessary move the
> manual disk, otherwise use some sort of file copy)
> (b) install the OS that came with the new machine on top of the result
> from (a)
>
> This sounds plausible. It does not deal with some remaining amount of
> hassle---meta info that may not adequately be captured by simply moving a
> file system.
At least in the case of Windows, the 'install the new version of the OS' on
top of the moved system is *not* simply equivalent to taking the new system
as pre-built and selectively moving portions of the old system over. A
Windows 'upgrade' installation actively attempts to migrate existing
applications to the new environment intelligently (not that I'm saying it's
smart enough to succeed in 100% of them, but it certainly does so
effectively for Microsoft's own applications plus a good portion of the
rest). What it attempts is more equivalent to an automated reinstallation
on the new system without having the original application installation disks
(though it may use them at appropriate points if they're available - I don't
know/remember at that level of detail).
As an example, I happened to encounter today confirmation (in a book that
I've found generally accurate) that Win98 can in fact be installed as an
upgrade to a system as old as Windows 3.1, and will create Win98-style
application groups into which it will move your old 3.1 applications. As I
said, I'm sure there are instances it can't handle perfectly, but it does
make the attempt and from what I've read at least often succeeds in making
the move relatively straight-forward.
In the case of a mac, the layout of files and finder windows
> on the desktop and PRAM info, in the case of windows registry values(???).
> The actual mechanics of doing this may also be sticky in terms of what is
> driving the machine during the process of (a) before (b)---presumably we
> will need to boot off CD rather than the internal HD.
Windows actually does a semi-decent job of boot-time configuration, to the
point that an image of your old system will quite possibly boot on a
different system - after which you can perform the upgrade installation.
>
> This sounds like it works for Mac and Linux. For MS it was my
> understanding that what you got with a new PC was NOT a set of disks
> adequate to install the OS but something rather lighter weight
My own experience with old first-or-second-tier players (Leading Edge and
AST) and newer third-tier players has been that you do indeed get a full
(though 'OEM') version of Windows (and while my recent IBM laptop came with
an IBM system-recovery disk rather than a full-fledged MS-stamped disk,
another participant in this discussion has suggested that if I perform an
installation with it it will turn out to be a full installation, just one
with some IBM 'extras' in it).
which, of
> course, does not allow us to preform step (b).
In this you may well be correct: there's a difference between a
full-fledged (but not 'upgrade') Windows installation and an upgrade
installation, and my one experience with trying to install an OEM version of
Windows in conjunction with an existing *different* version was that the
installation made me hide the existing version before continuing. My guess
is that a full retail Windows kit (which I've never used - OEM versions
always came with my systems, and I once bought a grey-market Win95 OSR2 OEM
version because Microsoft didn't offer OSR2 and its accompanying FAT32 and
USB support as an upgrade to Win95) allows upgrading, as do the half-price
'upgrade' versions, but that the OEM versions allow only a 'virgin' install
(so that people won't pass around their OEM disks to their buddies and allow
them to upgrade old systems for free).
But as I said in another post, that just means you may have to shell out $90
or so to buy an upgrade version that would make the process easier. And
while I'll agree that having to buy another version of the OS you already
paid for with the new hardware is annoying, it's not clear how Microsoft
could include this feature with its OEM version without significantly
eroding sales of its 'upgrade' versions (for the reason noted above), and
much as I dislike many of Microsoft's business practices I'm not sure I can
find too much fault with this one.
(As a side comment, I suspect that Microsoft made a bundle selling Win95
upgrades to existing systems - at least it was my impression at the time
that there was considerable pent-up demand for the new software. Whether
they have anywhere nearly as much upgrade business today I don't know: most
older PCs are kind of weak for running Win2K, but Win98 and Win98 Second
Edition may be popular upgrades to PCs originally purchased with Win95.)
Am I wrong in this---when
> you buy a new PC with say Win2000 pre-installed, do you get a full
> collection of Win2K disks
Yes, in my experience.
which would allow you to install 2K on top of an
> earlier MS OS?
No, in my experience, as explained above.
- bill
>
> Maynard
------------------------------
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