On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 08:53:02AM +0000, Bob Ham wrote: > local sessions are a subset of the functionality provided by network > sessions
If you want to have network transparency inside the audio framework, this perspective might be true. But you could also ignore network on the audio level and just treat remote components as special plugins in local sessions, plugins that use socket() to connect to another host. With this perspective, getting local things done becomes more important. You immediately want total recall in your plugin API. LV2 anyone? ;) The LV2-remote-controller-plugin could then (re-)connect to the remote host and launch stuff there. This stuff doesn't even need to know anything about jack. If it's data-triggered, you don't need a clock. Just send data, let remote end process it, receive it back in your local LV2 plugin and feed it into local jackd. As long as the whole process is fast enough, everything is fine. As already said, this is all a question of perspective. To me, having jamin (mastering-EQ/comp/limiter) as a stand alone application is a mistake. The mastering tool gets inserted in the project's master bus, and every project has its own required jamin settings. So when I open project A in Ardour, I want my mastering settings back. LV2 could do the trick. When I open project B, a different setting might be loaded. >From today's point of view, I would completely ignore jamin (or any other standalone jack application) and just use the LV2 version of the calf plugins. Total recall, easy to handle. The average music producer isn't interested in a bunch of single applications which he can wire up to something special. We need to get work done, and we need to save/recall work. On OSX and Win32, this is achieved by a decent editor (Cubase, ProTools, Logic) and tons of plugins. We have ardour as the decent editor, and we have LV2 plugins, perhaps not enough, yet. I wonder why Linux Audio always reinvents the wheel. Just look at the Win32 side: VST-Instruments, then put your favourite EQ on the outputs and your mastering compressor somewhere else. Still modular, but provides total recall. All we need is a decent plugin API, and LV2 seems to be the choice. Total recall then comes for free from this API. LASH? Don't know why I would want to use it, all my plugins get controlled via LV2 from the Ardour project. Looks like there are different stakeholders involved. The music producer's focus is the editor which gets extended by plugins. I'm such a representative. Whatever I do, I want to do it from ardour, inside ardour, saved in ardour. Ardour is the most important tool to me, and plugins are the salt to spice things up. Call me ignorant, but I don't have a single use case for netjack. I load a bunch of wav files, make some overdub recordings with mostly one (vocal) to twelve (drums) tracks simultaneously, trim regions, move snippets around, apply some FX, apply some parameter automation and mix it all together. Even a full-blown rock production won't exceed 150 channels. I can also afford to freeze channels if processing power gets low - I'm not constantly changing the drum EQs. Once setup correctly, I don't touch them anymore. So scalability isn't really an issue, here. I did 150 channels back in 2005 on a Quad-Xeon, it would surprise me if a modern machine couldn't handle it. And then, there seems to be people who'd constantly record the Vienna symphony orchestra with its hundreds of tracks, with endless demand of DSP processing power. Those who laugh at SSL, because their tiny 96 channel consoles cannot compete. I agree those people could benefit from network scalability. A third group is the signal processing coder/scientist who doesn't care about anything already mentioned. He's happy to hack his DSP code into some standalone app, manually/statically wire it via jack and that's it. So when talking about Pro Audio, I mean the music producer and his desire to have everything in his single editing software. Cubase, Ardour, ProTools. You name it. Moderate IO capabilities (usually somewhere between 16 and 64 channels), all available in a single box. (ProTools-HD, RME MADI, RME Fireface). So when Florian is talking about Pro Audio, he means large broadcasting studios and linux-under-the-hood, where a 128 channel desk is magically expanded by another 128 channel outboard I/O rack. Granted. To draw the conclusion: in my world, things are already pretty good as long as it's available as LV2. I haven't checked LV2 automation, yet, and I'd like to see a ping-pong delay be able to query/obey the host tempo. I'd like to see LV2 virtual instruments, that is, Linuxsampler and Hydrogen. Given that, I shouldn't really be participating in a thread called "LADI" ;) But perhaps I gave some insights on the everyday work of a music producer. And never forget: Hans Zimmer was able to win a Grammy with Logic on a single Apple laptop. ;) -- mail: [email protected] http://adi.thur.de PGP/GPG: key via keyserver _______________________________________________ Linux-audio-dev mailing list [email protected] http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
