Linux-Development-Sys Digest #342, Volume #6 Thu, 28 Jan 99 17:14:22 EST
Contents:
Re: xosview and 2.2.0 (Rik van Riel)
Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows (Chris Lee)
Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows (Gordon Scott)
Re: things I'd pay to have developed for Linux... (Thomas Zajic)
Re: [HELP] How to determine daemon's TCP/IP ports? (Chris Saia)
Re: xinit causes SEGFAULTS under Linux-2.2.0 (Winfried Magerl)
Re: Internal PCI modem (Johan Kullstam)
Re: Linux Phase 2: A Consumer Operating System (Ian Smith)
Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows (Leslie Mikesell)
Re: can't telnet to linux (Thomas Zajic)
Re: assert() change (Paul Kimoto)
Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: 2.2.0-final <-> 2.2.0 can't compile new kernel!! (Douglas Jerome)
Re: 2.2.0-final <-> 2.2.0 can't compile new kernel!! ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Parallel C for Linux (ondelette)
access memory on PCI-card ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Rik van Riel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: xosview and 2.2.0
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 16:52:08 +0100
On 27 Jan 1999, Andreas Heiss wrote:
> I just installed 2.2.0 final.
> When running xosview, I see strange network traffic all time.
> The 'netmeter' doesn't work at all. Real network traffic isn't displayed.
> I guess, the reason are the changes in the /proc.
> But how can I fix it ? /proc backward compatibilty is enabled in the
> kernel config.
You should try recompiling xosview. It works out of
the box on my system...
Rik -- If a Microsoft product fails, who do you sue?
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Linux Memory Management site: http://humbolt.geo.uu.nl/Linux-MM/ |
| Nederlandse Linux documentatie: http://www.nl.linux.org/ |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chris Lee)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
Date: 28 Jan 1999 17:02:24 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
>
>One other thing. A good direction is the HOWTO's they give the user
>examples.
>However if a user has trouble, he/she is being told by the experienced
>users to read the man-page. So he/she does. Then what?
>
>Anyway, to make a long story short, we (the UNIX/Linux community) need
>to rewrite the man-pages and put them in a seperate package.
>
>Any comments?
Sure. Rewrite the man pages yourself. What? You don't want to be the one who
does that? Thought so...
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gordon Scott)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
Date: 28 Jan 1999 15:54:12 GMT
Reply-To: Gordon Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Walter van der Schee ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: Anyway, to make a long story short, we (the UNIX/Linux community) need
: to rewrite the man-pages and put them in a seperate package.
Man pages as they exist now are a very concise and rich source of
information. The trouble with 'concise' is that it also implies not
too much detailed explanation. I think that's part of the reason for
the lack of examples in many pages. Sometimes that's a pity.
Rather than rewriting all the man pages -- and there are rather a lot
of those -- writing an (on-line?) beginners guide might be a better route.
That's where we get people started with basic tools and common usage.
It's also where we explain the structure of man pages and include
hyperlinks to them.
There are some Unix tutorials around already. LDP has the Linux
"Installation and getting Started Guide" and "The Linux User's
Guide". There may be others -- there are certainly some books.
Newbie guides need to be hierarchical from the 'almost condescending'
to suitable for reasonably familiar users. Like unwrapping an onion --
the outside skin is the absolute basics and once you've understood it
you can discard it and get to deeper and deeper layers of flesh.
'The Trouble'(tm) with Unix is that it was originally documented for
people who were trained, so there was no real need for the basics. That
is changing, many new users are self-teaching and Unix is definitely not
a trivial thing to learn.
Gordon.
--
Gordon Scott Opinions expressed are my own.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (official) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (backdoor)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (home) http://www.apis.demon.co.uk
Linux ............... Because I like to _get_ there today.
------------------------------
From: Thomas Zajic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.hardware
Subject: Re: things I'd pay to have developed for Linux...
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 02:27:03 GMT
Keith G. Murphy wrote:
> I think I'm missing something non-obvious. I actually had looked
> through my "Linux in a Nutshell" before posting my last message, and
> found nothing. It doesn't mention 'e2label', or the '-L' option of
> tune2fs. I'll have to look at those.
Those were first implemented in e2fsprogs-1.12, IIRC. The latest version
is 1.14, get it from http://web.mit.edu/tytso/www/linux/e2fsprogs.html
> Oh, well, I did say "apparently". At least I didn't make a categorical
> statement and look like an ass! >:-)
;-)
Thomas
--
=---------------------------------------------------------------------=
- Thomas Zajic aka ZlatkO ThE GoDFatheR, Vienna/Austria -
- Spam-proof e-mail: thomas(DOT)zajic(AT)teleweb(DOT)at -
=---------------------------------------------------------------------=
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: [HELP] How to determine daemon's TCP/IP ports?
From: Chris Saia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 28 Jan 1999 13:18:35 -0500
Lam Dang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Given an executable running on, say, Red Hat
> 5.2, is it possible to determine the TCP/IP port
> or ports it responds to, without documentation and
> source? If so, what's the best way to do it?
Try lsof(8). You'll probably need to download it from vic.cc.purdue.edu.
--
===============================================================================
[EMAIL PROTECTED], WTnet IRC Administrator -- http://www.wtower.com/~csaia
PGP Public Key is available at http://www.wtower.com/~csaia/Personal/pubkey.asc
===============================================================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Winfried Magerl)
Subject: Re: xinit causes SEGFAULTS under Linux-2.2.0
Date: 28 Jan 1999 19:09:33 +0100
In article <78ph8v$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Dear Linux gurus,
>
>With Linux-2.2.0 on my "playground" Linux box (Pentium,
>egcs-2.93.03 or egcs-2.91.59, glibc-2.0.110, XFre86-3.3.3.1),
>I have seen a surprising phenomenon: Instead of starting X11,
>startx (or xdm) cause a floating point error.
[....]
Upgrade your glibc to glibc-2.0.111. I had similour problems
after updating the kernel from 2.2.0-pre8 to 2.2.0-pre9.
Build/install of glibc-2.0.111 fix the problems.
regards
winfried
--
Winfried Magerl - Internet Administration
Siemens Business Services, 81739 Munich, Germany
Internet-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Internal PCI modem
Date: 28 Jan 1999 12:22:58 -0500
Brian Knowlton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> An add that I saw, refered to the modem as an HSP modem
> and stated that: "Their low cost HSP design utilizes your
> PC's spare processing power to process modem functions."
> The modems are from Boca Research, and I would suspect that
> they are WinModems, based on the above statement at least.
> I also checked out Gateway computers, and they only offer
> a WinModem on thier Xeon machine (at least as of 2 days ago).
> I do not want to spend hundreds of dollars on a high end CPU
> so that it can handle the work that my modem should be
> handling!
can you buy a gateway PC *without* a modem altogether? that way you
could get anything you like afterwards. this method of packaging
where you put one winner together with several items of lesser quality
is extremely frustrating and tends to undermine the freeness of the
market.
--
johan kullstam
------------------------------
From: Ian Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Linux Phase 2: A Consumer Operating System
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 23:24:55 +0000
David Magda wrote:
>
> He's giving us options for the future. Whether we follow them is up to us
> and not written in stone. We are just beginning to see the commercialization
> (sp?) of GNU/Linux and we have to think about it. Even now, RPM is the most
> popular package manager but dselect is supposed to be better. Is this the old
> VHS vs. Beta cliche again? I'm currently using RH5.0 on my main system
In that case please explain how rpm could put deb out of business [g].
--
============================================================================
Ian Smith
============================================================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
Date: 28 Jan 1999 13:39:44 -0600
In article <78p5jl$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>You really need to digest the man page for the shell you use before
>>you worry about command line syntax for any other program,
>
>oh please.
>
>The guy is giving you a valid point of how an example can explain
>something that 100 lines can not, and you answer by telling them to
>go read another 1000 lines so that they can understand the original 100
>lines !
Yes. And he will also understand the man pages for the other 500 programs
that also assume that you know what the shell does to the line you
type before any other program sees it.
>next, you'll be asking users to study the theory of operating systems
>before they type anything on the command line.
People who don't want to understand how things are done should not
be reading man pages. That is what they are about.
People who want prepackaged 'only-one-way-to-do-it' solutions should
stick to the front-end user interfaces that are designed to shield
the user from having to know how anything works. Webmin, linuxconf,
the RedHat control-panel utilities, etc., all make a fair attempt
at this.
>Now, what is it about some Unix people that they can not see the forest when
>looking at the trees, when it is shown in all other fields that examples
>help new users learn faster and understand better?
Would you say that the field of medicine would be easier to learn if
the basic books had some example prescription forms filled out so
you didn't have to bother learning the reasons for each or how to
come up with the correct dosage?
>we are talking about new users comming to use Linux for first time, and
>suggesting simple things, like adding examples in man pages, to help them
>in the process.
I don't see a lot of middle ground here. You either understand what
rm -rf . means or you shouldn't be typing it. If you want to learn,
you need also to learn what happens if there are any shell metacharacters
on the line (wildcard expansion, variable substition, i/o redirection, etc.).
>Once one is not frightned away from Unix after first few days, then they
>have the rest of their lifes to read about the theory of shells and commands.
>
>But first things first. It is not this or that, but one can have both.
Yes, you have to start somewhere, but if the example in the man
page works as it appears then it might as well have been a shell
script in /bin so you could just type it's name instead of looking
up the example. Or it could have been a push button in a GUI.
>I think it is becuase Unix has been foriegn to end users having direct access
>to it, the Unix programmer have developed this strange way of looking at
>the world. They really need to wake up, and get out from front of their
>computers and go talk to real end users once in a while.
No, the current situation is the result of experience with end users not
a new thing. End users that don't want to learn how to use power tools
should have someone else do it for them.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Thomas Zajic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: can't telnet to linux
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 03:10:50 GMT
wim delvaux wrote:
> eddycheung wrote:
> > Recent I can't telnet to my linux using by users account which have
> > administrator rights, the linux also say the password is wrong. I can
> > only telnet as root or using those accounts in console. What's wrong
> > with it?
> > Beside, for all newly created user accounts. They also can't login to my
> > system even in console. How can I do?
> > Eddy
> Did you check the logfile in /var/log (...)
> Did you verify the hosts.aloow hosts.deny
> Wim
Look for a file called �/etc/nologin� - if it exists, �rm� it.
Thomas
--
=---------------------------------------------------------------------=
- Thomas Zajic aka ZlatkO ThE GoDFatheR, Vienna/Austria -
- Spam-proof e-mail: thomas(DOT)zajic(AT)teleweb(DOT)at -
=---------------------------------------------------------------------=
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Paul Kimoto)
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: assert() change
Date: 27 Jan 1999 22:41:29 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[note: followup changed]
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, gilley wrote:
[mildly reformatted]
> This is probably pretty stupid but...
> What incompatibilities, problems would this change cause?
>
> in assert.h
> #ifdef NDEBUG
> # define assert(expr) expr /* changed from assert(expr)
> ((void*)0) */
>
> this lets you do
> assert(i = malloc(10)); //some real work inside the assert
> instead of
> i = NULL;
> i = malloc(10);
> assert(i != NULL);
>
> #ifdef NDEBUG
> you would get
> i = malloc(10);
>
> It is a small change but promotes invariance programming.
It would cause an incompatibility with the standard, which pronounces
(section 7.2) that
If NDEBUG is defined as a macro name at the point in
the source file where <assert.h> is included, the assert
macro is defined simply as
#define assert(ignore) ((void)0)
Presumably this is in case you want to want to assert something that
is relatively expensive to compute.
Nothing should stop you from defining a macro myassert() that acts
like you prefer, though.
--
Paul Kimoto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
Date: 28 Jan 1999 12:05:52 -0800
In article <78qee0$ka$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
>
>>we are talking about new users comming to use Linux for first time, and
>>suggesting simple things, like adding examples in man pages, to help them
>>in the process.
>
>I don't see a lot of middle ground here. You either understand what
>rm -rf . means or you shouldn't be typing it.
You are really not thinking here.
The example will help someone UNDERSTAND what a command means.
one shows an example, then explain what the example does.
An example is an illustration. it is an aid to help someone understand.
An example alone byitself is not enough offcourse. it just helps people
understand. it is something extra. some might not need it, some might.
>
>No, the current situation is the result of experience with end users not
>a new thing. End users that don't want to learn how to use power tools
>should have someone else do it for them.
>
> Les Mikesell
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I think you are just going off a steep tanget here.
Examples help users learn. First, you do not want examples that will
help users learn, then you complain that user do not want to learn.
amazing logic you have.
All what people are saying, is that one or two examples at end of a man page
helps many people understand something more. This is not a new concept,
VMS had this for more than 25 years now. In VMS every command has examples,
does this mean VMS users are dump, or VMS engineers like to waste their
time by adding all those examples to every VMS command?
Your position is opposing this simple and obviouse point just
goes to show why Unix might never makes it as an end user system and why
many new users view it as hard to use.
Maybe one day the Unix programmers will wake up before it is too late.
Kirk
------------------------------
From: Douglas Jerome <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: 2.2.0-final <-> 2.2.0 can't compile new kernel!!
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 21:31:05 -0700
Did y'all really get sound? I used the fix and got
the kernel to link together, but I still don't get
any sound :(
--
Douglas Jerome
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: 2.2.0-final <-> 2.2.0 can't compile new kernel!!
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 03:39:26 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Trever Adams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> A James Lewis wrote:
> > drivers/sound/sound.a(sb_ess.o): In function `ess_init':
> > sb_ess.o(.text+0xe12): undefined reference to `esstype'
> > sb_ess.o(.text+0xea7): undefined reference to `esstype'
> > make: *** [vmlinux] Error 1
>
> Go edit linux/drivers/sound/sb_card.c Move the line int esstype up a
> few lines so it is before #ifdef MODULES
>
> This probably isn't the most accurate fix (may waste some memory if you
> aren't compiling as a module) but it works.
>
> Trever
>
Thanks Trever.
Worked for me.
Van
==================================
Linux rocks!!! www.dedserius.com
==================================
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From: ondelette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Parallel C for Linux
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 23:13:03 -0500
Take a look at
http://supertech.lcs.mit.edu/cilk/
-dt
Tom Goodale wrote:
>
> Vitor Pedro Bonucci Pias wrote:
> >
> > I have my system running Dual pentium II 450.
> >
> > The system runing fine with kernel-2.2.0-pre7,
> >
> > and i would like to know if there is a Parallel C
> >
> > compiler for Linux to explore the Parallelisme.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Pedro Pias
>
> I don't know of any parallel c compilers, but if you can put up with
> distributed memory parallelism, you could use pvm or mpi.
>
> Tom
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: access memory on PCI-card
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 20:37:18 GMT
I try to make a device-driver for a PCI-card on Linux 2.0.x.
I read PCI-configuration data using the pci_* functions. I get
the correct memory-adresses in my driver. Then I run vremap()
to remap 0xf0805000. My driver reports this:
-
pci-dio-32hs detected
base ioaddr: 0xf0805000
vremap() success - memory mapped from 0xf0805000 to 0x281e000
val: 0xff
Code that remaps memory:
-
/*remap memory*/
mem_ptr_virt = NULL;
if( (mem_ptr_virt=vremap((u_long)ioaddr,4096))==NULL ) {
printk("vremap() failed\n");
}
else {
printk("vremap() success - memory mapped from 0x%lx to 0x%lx\n",(u_long)
ioaddr,(u_long)mem_ptr_virt);
}
I then try to access the card using code like this:
-
memset(mem_ptr_virt+PORTB_POLARITY, 0x00,1);
memset(mem_ptr_virt+PORTB_MASK, 0x00,1);
memset(mem_ptr_virt+PORTB_DIRECTION, 0xff,1);
memset(mem_ptr_virt+PORTB, 0xFF, 1);
val=readb(mem_ptr_virt+PORTB);
printk("val: 0x%x\n",val);
I am not able to read or write any values to this card. Values read
are never as expected. Values written doesn't do anything. What am I doing
wrong ?
/proc/pci reports this on the card:
-
Bus 0, device 20, function 0:
Unknown class: Unknown vendor Unknown device (rev 1).
Vendor id=1093. Device id=1150.
Medium devsel. Fast back-to-back capable. IRQ 10. Master Capable.
Latency=32.
Non-prefetchable 32 bit memory at 0xf0804000.
Non-prefetchable 32 bit memory at 0xf0805000.
The two memory-areas are:
Base Address Register 0 - MITE (system bus interface logic)
Base Address Register 1 - DAQ-DIO and RTSI registers (digital I/O logic)
Tommy - please cc: any answers to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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