Linux-Development-Sys Digest #363, Volume #6 Mon, 1 Feb 99 22:13:55 EST
Contents:
Re: disheartened gnome developer ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Linux SMP support ("Roberto P.Martins Jr.")
2.2.0 Per-process memory limit? (Sam Lantinga)
Re: Kernel is too big (Markus Schutz)
Leaf Project second release (Ross Vandegrift)
Re: Linux Phase 2: A Consumer Operating System (Christopher Browne)
Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows (Lucas Sheehan)
Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows ("Paul E. Lehmann")
Re: Rewriting IDLE Process - Need Strategic Advice - part 1 (Carl Spalletta)
Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows (deceased)
Re: Rewriting IDLE Process - Need Strategic Advice - part 1 (Stefan Monnier)
Re: How to flush the file cache ? ("Bjorn Wesen")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.x
Subject: Re: disheartened gnome developer
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 20:20:21 GMT
In article <78s11g$k13$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Mike Willett LADS LDN X7563) wrote:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Marcin Krol) writes:
> >On Sun, 24 Jan 1999 14:03:47 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >wrote:
> ><snip>
> >>>This may be true ideally, but I certainly never heard any evidence
> >>>that it works in practice. Ask any recent emmigrant from the Union of
> >>>Soviet Socialist Republics how efficiently their economic system was
> >>>working when they left.
> >
> >>About the only way in which the USSR was socialist is in name.
> >
> >No, it was not.
> >
>
> From what I read of Socialism - USSR was NOT a true socialist state
> What features of USSR do you think it is a true socialist model.
>
USSR was the closest to book implementation of socialism. It was never
claimed to be a communist state. They called it "fully developed socialism"
- translation from Russian, they meant that they were in the last stage of
the development of the socialism. The discussion of features is happning
currently in a quite a few news groups.
============= Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ============
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
------------------------------
From: "Roberto P.Martins Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Linux SMP support
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 19:14:48 -0300
<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
Hello all,
<p>I'm looking for information about SMP on Linux. At RedHat site I found
on symmetric multi-processor systems I need to build a custom kernel because
SMP support is still experimental in kernel 2.0.xx
<p>And now with kernel 2.2.xx? Does anybody know how's SMP support? There
are any site with related information?
<p>--
<br>Roberto P.Martins Jr.
<br><A HREF="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]</A>
<br><A
HREF="http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lab/9636">http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lab/9636</A>
<br>ICQ #12393737
<br> </html>
------------------------------
From: Sam Lantinga <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: 2.2.0 Per-process memory limit?
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 13:37:05 -0800
What is the per-process memory limit, and how do I modify it?
I'm trying to link object code greater than 16 MB, and the linker fails
with
"virtual memory exhausted", even though I show 60MB free memory.
--
See ya!
-Sam Lantinga ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Lead Programmer, Loki Entertainment Software
--
Author of Simple DirectMedia Layer -
http://www.devolution.com/~slouken/SDL/
--
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 23:24:33 +0100
From: Markus Schutz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Kernel is too big
Hi,
Try 'make bzImage', this enables the making of big images.
Markus
Chiyu Wang wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> I am trying to install Cyclades-Z drivers into 2.0.36 kernel. After
> "make dep ; make clean" and "make zlilo", I copy:
> /usr/src/linux-2.0.36/vmlinux* (657022 Jan 31 01:31)
> to:
> /boot/vmlinuz-2.0.36-0.7.new
> and made it as a boot kernel image in /etc/lilo.conf. The current boot
> image is still kept at:
> /boot/vmlinuz-2.0.36-0.7 (454325 Jul 17 01:07)
>
> However, after running /sbin/lilo, a message shows on the screen
>
> Kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.0.36-0.7.new is too big
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> Obviously, I can not use the new kernel image. The current image can
> boot well. Since I already configured all necessary components as
> modules, as long as they could. Can anyone tell what else I can do to
> make the kernel small enough?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Chiyu
--
A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is
nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.
Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
=================================================================
Markus SCHÜTZ
8, Ch. des Aubépines Phone: ++41 21 646 9362
CH-1004 Lausanne mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Switzerland
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Foothills/9297
=================================================================
------------------------------
From: Ross Vandegrift <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Leaf Project second release
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 17:24:23 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hello all,
I have updated the Leaf Project home page and uploaded a new source
archive at www.erols.com/vandegrift/index.html. Unless I get commentary
dictating otherwise, I think I shall start on the kernel level
interface. Simulating it further with command line options would be
needlessly tedious. I have never written a kernel level driver, so
expect this to take a bit longer than that mixer did. Thanks a bunch!
Ross Vandegrift
http://www.erols.com/vandegrift/index.html
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
Ross Vandegrift | Eric J. Fenderson
A novice was trying to fix a broken Lisp machine by turning the power
off and on. Knight, seeing what the student was doing spoke sternly:
"You can not fix a machine by just power-cycling it with no
understanding of what is going wrong." Knight turned the machine off
and on. The machine worked.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Christopher Browne)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Linux Phase 2: A Consumer Operating System
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 01:23:49 GMT
On Sun, 31 Jan 1999 17:51:08 GMT, steve mcadams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>[Snipped for brevity, quoted material marked with ">"]
>On Wed, 20 Jan 1999 02:01:32 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Christopher
>Browne) wrote:
>
>>With the result that many of the sorts of folk that made Linux grow into
>>what it has become are liable to migrate off to other systems that
>>permit them to "play" again. Whether that's Hurd, Xos, FluxOS, *BSD, or
>>whatever.
>>
>>At that point, Linux starts to die. It may continue on for years, but
>>if the sources of innovation leave, that causes great injury.
>
>I don't see how adding more bolt-on capabilities to a rugged high
>performance operating system is going to make it any less interesting.
>In fact it will probably make it more interesting because more users
>will find more interesting problems to solve. -steve
If it takes more than "bolting it on," then the OS starts to suffer.
- Some of the features of Hurd involve breaking off things that Linux
does. It adds the ability to mount $PATH as /bin, which makes the
various binary paths go away. Similarly, /usr goes away.
- Xos involves throwing away virtually the whole kernel, and
reimplementing kernel functionality as sharable libraries. Applications
may still be usable, supposing a reasonably compatible API, but the base
kernel goes away *entirely.*
- FluxOS lies somewhere in between. It pushes a lot of kernel
functionality out to libraries, and exposes additional pieces of system
management. Again, while portably written applications may not notice a
change, the kernel gets changed quite completely.
The fact that all of these systems provide *similar* APIs as you get to
the application level means that there may be a migration path from
[present Linux] to [new OS that's quite different].
But they're quite sufficiently different that they do not reflect "bolt
ons." Their approaches require eliminating and replacing the Linux
kernel.
--
"NT 5.0 is the last nail in the Unix coffin. Interestingly, Unix isn't
in the coffin... It's wondering what the heck is sealing itself into a
wooden box 6 feet underground..." -- Jason McMullan
[EMAIL PROTECTED] <http://www.hex.net/~cbbrowne/oses.html>
------------------------------
From: Lucas Sheehan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 17:38:41 -0800
Peter Samuelson wrote:
> [<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>]
> > My goal in life is to go through all the man pages and rewrite them
> > into something vaguely resembling english.
>
> Out of curiosity, how many have you completed?
>
> --
> Peter Samuelson
> <sampo.creighton.edu!psamuels>
Interesting task to undertake. My man pages came in english.
------------------------------
From: "Paul E. Lehmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1999 21:02:54 -0500
You can get all the Unix utilities and even run a Korn shell in NT by using
software such as MKS Toolkit
Why put up with the pain of Unix or Linux when you can have all the
so-called advantages and a hell of a lot friendlier user environment and a
hell of a lot more versatile environment. Pearl, sed, awk, grep, vi -
piping, redirection - they are all there without the Nerdy Unix environment.
Sorry folks - Unix and Linux are about 20 years behind times and will NEVER
catch up.
Lucas Sheehan wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>Peter Samuelson wrote:
>
>> [<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>]
>> > My goal in life is to go through all the man pages and rewrite them
>> > into something vaguely resembling english.
>>
>> Out of curiosity, how many have you completed?
>>
>> --
>> Peter Samuelson
>> <sampo.creighton.edu!psamuels>
>
>Interesting task to undertake. My man pages came in english.
>
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Carl Spalletta)
Subject: Re: Rewriting IDLE Process - Need Strategic Advice - part 1
Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 02:21:12 GMT
On 01 Feb 1999 18:34:09 -0500, Stefan Monnier
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>Oh and shredding is only useful for really paranoid people and unless done with
>extreme care is utterly useless.
>
I'm guessing that you are referring to the difficulty of finding a
truly random sequence to do the writeover with, but what else might
you have in mind?
Another respondent stated that since each bit of each write sequence
tended to vary slightly from the theoretical dead center position
where it ought to go that it was possible to analyze the disk contents
in order to uncover the original data underneath. Are you also
referring to that? Of course it only begs the question of how the
investigator knows which layer he is interested in, especial if one
does multiple overwrites (using the idle process these only occur when
the run queue is empty anyway). Also since the resolving power of any
such technique must be in practice limited there must be some number
of overwrites that will completely fill the available spaces and mash
whatever data is underneath, correct?
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.setup
From: deceased <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 00:04:51 GMT
weeelll
i think i'll add my 2 cents <waiting for everyone to groan> i've been
running linux for a lill' over a year now.. and i'm fucking beyond happy=20
with it. as you'll learn, david there are things you can do that you
could never even think about doing under win 9x.. first thing that ever
blew my mind, was the ">" command.. I had a HUGE python lib, and instead=20
of pag'n thru my files.. I redirected them into a text file.. wow! I was=20
hooked from there.. it's like stumbling about the holy grail, it will
infect you.. you soon will become a unix nerd like us, and fall inlove
with it's complex ness.. you could run unix, learn perl, python ect..
program in bsh, and _still_ learn handfulls a day.. it's beautiful..
just wanted to let you know the feelings of another linux lovin' human..=20
mouse? I don't even use my mouse anymore.. noithing is like sitting back=20
(leaning back.. reeel far) in your lazy chair.. and doing more,
faster... than you could do, huntched over your keyboard and mouse..keep=20
learning, and trying.. and sooner or later.. unix will just unlock your
mind to thousands of new commands... Oh., and a side note.. to people
who keep bashing unix.. cool, more power to them.. but, but but.. if
they ran unix, and learned it's power.. (much like a different spoken
language) there are things one cannot think about, until learned.. (very=20
much how spanish has a word for "traveling with no destination, or
start" and in english, we couldent express that crazy concept in one
word.. (sorry bout' the randomnes) well.. thoes are my 2 cents.. from
the Tandy TSR 80--to the Pent Winbox, to the linux box.. all are fun..
but linux is beautiful.
-Miles
On Sat, 23 Jan 1999, David P. Greenberg wrote:
> Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 04:21:25 -0500
> From: "David P. Greenberg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Newsgroups: alt.os.linux, comp.os.linux.development.system,
> comp.os.linux.development.apps, comp.os.linux.setup
> Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
>=20
> Thank you very much for your reply. I didn't mean to pinpoint this
> specific issue, but rather to demonstrate some of my (and possibly others=
)
> frustrations in trying to learn the OS. If you're coming from a windows
> background, where pretty much everything is done for you or at least
> nicely albeit somewhat pedantically explained, then this seems pretty muc=
h
> overwhealming. The MAN pages speak to you in the same "Geekese" that the
> rest of the system does. Here's what I'd like to see. {To install a
> program in Linux: Press button marked install, watch pretty display, run
> program, eat breakfast, go to work}. Here's what I get. {Make
> /fstab=3Dman/root/slash/etc/estab/root/man.rpm for more info go to
> Man/fstab/root.} OK sure. Bash -no such file or directory... You get the
> point. I'm not trying to complain here. As I've said before, I'm willing
> to keep trying. I beat Win-blows, and I'll beat this. In the mean time,
> please keep the good advice coming. Thank you.
>=20
> David P. Greenberg
> Bitco Electronics
> "In Service to the Recording Industry"
> www.tiac.net/users/bitco
> *Just a babe in the Linux woods*
>=20
> On Fri, 22 Jan 1999, Thomas Zajic wrote:
>=20
> > Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 14:10:03 GMT
> > From: Thomas Zajic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Newsgroups: alt.os.linux, comp.os.linux.development.system,
> > comp.os.linux.development.apps, comp.os.linux.setup
> > Subject: Re: Why I'm dumping Linux, going back to Windblows
> >=20
> > David P. Greenberg wrote:
> > > [ ... ]
> > > 1) How come, when I change a bunch of things in X and reeboot,
> > > comes back the way it was?
> >=20
> > Well, first of all: do yourself a favor and get rid of that "Your mouse
> > has moved. You have to reboot for the changes to take effect."
> > mentality.
> > This is all fine and dandy for Win9X/NT, but not at all needed under
> > Linux.
> >=20
> > If you=B4re just tweaking X, it=B4s enough to quit and restart the X se=
rver
> > with startx (if you "tweaked" something so that X just hangs, don=B4t h=
it
> > the reset button - CTRL-ALT-BKSPC will kill X just fine and dump you
> > back into the console).
> >=20
> > If you=B4re only tweaking your window manager (fvwm[2|95] or whatever),
> > it=B4s not even necessary to restart X. Most (if not all) window manage=
rs
> > have a "Restart" option (the fvwm*=B4s do have one for sure), use this
> > one instead.
> >=20
> > As for "everything comes back the way it was", note that X (and any X
> > related components, such as window managers) are usually reading their
> > config files in a certain order (system-wide stuff usually in /etc or
> > the /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/ hierarchy, user specific stuff in the user=B4s
> > home dir). So, if you changed a system-wide setting, but happen to have
> > some stale config files lying around in your home dir without (or even
> > overriding) these changes, chances are that your user config files take
> > precedence over the system-wide ones, and your changes are seemingly
> > ignored.
> >=20
> > I=B4m sure you=B4re not happy to hear this, but please _do_ read the ma=
n
> > pages - I know they=B4re huge and a pain to go through especially for X=
,
> > but they _do_ contain the information you=B4re looking for. "The X-File=
s -
> > The Truth Is Out There" (with apologies to Special Agent Fox Mulder ;-)=
=2E
> >=20
> > Thomas
> > --=20
> > =3D--------------------------------------------------------------------=
-=3D
> > - Thomas Zajic aka ZlatkO ThE GoDFatheR, Vienna/Austria -
> > - Spam-proof e-mail: thomas(DOT)zajic(AT)teleweb(DOT)at -
> > =3D--------------------------------------------------------------------=
-=3D
> >=20
> >=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
------------------------------
From: Stefan Monnier
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Rewriting IDLE Process - Need Strategic Advice - part 1
Date: 01 Feb 1999 18:34:09 -0500
>>>>> "Carl" == Carl Spalletta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I thought it would be a nice touch to rewrite the idle process to do
> some useful work.
People have already thought about that, don't worry.
> The new Idle process would do an incremental partial defrag
> possibly followed up by a "shredding" of discarded files.
Do you actually have any clear indication that your ext2fs partitions are
fragmented ? It's not because Mickeysoft's most famous filesystem nedds
daily defragmentation to maintain a not-even acceptable performance that
all filesystems suffer from the same brain-damage.
Oh and shredding is only useful for really paranoid people and unless done with
extreme care is utterly useless.
Stefan
------------------------------
From: "Bjorn Wesen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: How to flush the file cache ?
Date: Tue, 2 Feb 1999 01:03:10 +0100
Renaud Lottiaux wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>I don't want to write back to disk durty data but
>to clean out the file cache. When using the "sync"
>command, pending writes are completed, but data
>stay in cache.
>
>I would like to REMOVE all data from the cache
>to be sure that next read will be performed
>from the disk and not from the cache.
You need to remount the disk in question. The remount will both flush and
invalidate the pages, buffers and dcache for that device. Same magic used
when switching removable media.
If you are running in a driver or the kernel you can of course do the same
without umount/mount (invalidate_inodes() and friends), but I assume you are
talking about user-land.
/Bjorn
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Development-System Digest
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