Linux-Development-Sys Digest #731, Volume #7 Mon, 3 Apr 00 04:13:19 EDT
Contents:
Re: How compatible is Linux with .. Linux (Michael Powe)
Re: How compatible is Linux with .. Linux (Rod Roark)
Re: How compatible is Linux with .. Linux (Tor Slettnes)
kernel loader ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
vfat filesystem support in 2.3.51 kernel ("Thomas Hunt")
Re: Partition Access (Kaz Kylheku)
Re: Doing dead function elimination without -finline-functions in (Graham Stoney)
RFD: comp.os.linux.embedded (John C. Peterson)
Re: not able to get changes after kernel build ("D. Stimits")
Help with ostringstream... (Michael A Uman)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Michael Powe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.apps
Subject: Re: How compatible is Linux with .. Linux
Date: 02 Apr 2000 16:20:41 -0700
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>>>>> "Peter" == Peter T Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
In comp.os.linux.development.apps Rod Roark
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: : On 2 Apr 2000 09:50:20
GMT, Peter T. Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: :>...
:>These questions are so naive that I wouldn't trust any
programmer that :>has to ask them....
: The poster didn't say he's a programmer. Are naive
questions : forbidden?
:>I suggest you desist from distributing your binary and make
available
:>the code, so that at least it can be corrected by people who will
:>be less ignorant! Carrying on as you seem to be doing will probably
:>only get you bad press. If you want detailed advice on particular
:>distros policies, contact the distro.
: That's incredibly rude. Mr. Breuer, you make us all look bad.
Peter> It's incredibly good advice. Rudeness does not enter into
Peter> it. Exactly who are you trying to protect? I was trying to
Peter> protect them, and you, in about equal magnitude. Having bad
Peter> software out there IS bad, and having bad linux software
Peter> out there makes linux look bad.
Rudeness does enter into it -- you're just socially incompetent.
You're so clueless that you think it's impossible to give advice
without being rude.
We don't need your protection. We are capable of evaluating software
without the aid of "geniuses" like yourself. We are not, however,
capable of undoing all the damage that is done by mean-spirited linux
know-it-alls like yourself, who ridicule and belittle those who are
not members of the "in-crowd."
People with some experience in the real world know that the
cooperation and politeness are the main media for successful
completion of projects. Linus Torvalds did not get where he is by
calling people names; you should take a clue from him, since you're
obviously a legend in your own mind -- too smart to learn anything
from anyone here.
mp
- --
BOYCOTT AMAZON http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/amazon.html BOYCOTT AMAZON
"For example, I've always liked PowerPoint, and I've always thought
that Visual Basic was a good product." -- Linus Torvalds
Michael Powe Portland, Oregon USA
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From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rod Roark)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.apps
Subject: Re: How compatible is Linux with .. Linux
Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 00:22:41 GMT
On 2 Apr 2000 17:36:19 GMT, Peter T. Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In comp.os.linux.development.apps Rod Roark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>: On 2 Apr 2000 09:50:20 GMT, Peter T. Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>:>...
>:>These questions are so naive that I wouldn't trust any programmer that
>:>has to ask them....
>
>: The poster didn't say he's a programmer. Are naive questions
>: forbidden?
>
>From a person trying to get a commercial product out the door, yes.
>If he isn't the project architect, then what's he doing posting?
Perhaps he's a prospective investor in the project, or otherwise
someone unfamiliar with Linux who nevertheless has a reason to know
more. There are plenty of possible reasons, many quite interesting.
But that question is yours, not his, and just because you don't know
the answer doesn't mean the other guy is a moron.
>...
>: That's incredibly rude. Mr. Breuer, you make us all look bad.
>
>It's incredibly good advice. Rudeness does not enter into it....
Consider if you would use the same words in person. I think not,
unless you're extremely large.
-- Rod
======================================================================
Sunset Systems Preconfigured Linux Computers
http://www.sunsetsystems.com/ and Custom Software
======================================================================
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.apps
Subject: Re: How compatible is Linux with .. Linux
From: Tor Slettnes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 00:27:50 GMT
>>>>> "H" == H McKame <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
H> Hi My company is currently finishing its product on Red Hat
H> 6.1. Given the multiplicity of Linux versions, we are worried
H> about distributing our product on Linux in general.
Only you can determine the viability of this. Is increased sales and
good PR worth the act of testing (and possibly provide minor
adjustments) for your application to work on other distributions as
well? Only you can tell.
(Companies that release "only for RedHat 6.1" are usually considered
somewhat ignorant in this fairly techno-savvy market).
H> You out there that have already gone this route, could you
H> please share your experience:
H> - How compatible are Linux versions between vendors on the
H> executable format (a.out), and on the object format (.o) ?
RedHat 6.1 does not use `a.out' by default, even if it is still
supported. Nor has any other Linux distribution done for a half
decade. The ELF binary format is now the standard.
(Do not confuse the AOUT format with the "a.out" file created after
linking).
You might also want to know that the current standard C library is
glibc2.1 - which supports, among other things, Corba-like versioning.
H> On what Linux versions will a pre-link on RedHat 6.1 link and
H> execute correctly ?
Most likely on every Linux distribution you can find. You would want
to test it on at least the major classes of distributions, as laid out
in the following hierarchy:
- RedHat 6.0 and above, plus derivatives:
- ManDrake 7.0
- Caldera OpenLinux
- SuSE Linux
- Debian GNU/Linux 2.1 and above, plus derivatives:
- Corel Linux
- Storm Linux
- Libranet Linux
- Slackware
- Stampede
H> How does one measure this compatibility (egcs version? glibc
H> version? xf86 version?)
glibc, xf86, libstc++, lib<anythingyourapplicationdependson>,
plus the FHS (file hierarchy standard), and a host of other
considerations.
More simply: By testing. Or better yet, the availability of source
code, so that bugs in your application can be fixed - rather than be
met with a response from you akin to "your distribution is not
supported".
(That would be the way to keep people from using your application).
H> - How general is the rpm packaging format for the release?
It is used in RedHat, ManDrake, Caldera and SuSE (but with different
directory structures in each one). It is not used in Debian, Corel,
Storm, Libranet, Slackware or Stampede.
If you _must_ release as RPM only, you might want to test an install
using the "alien" program under other distributions.
--
F�r i ulvekl�r
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: kernel loader
Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 11:11:14 +1000
Hi,
I would like to know if anyone can point me to some information on the
linux execuatable loader and the processes that it follows when it loads
an execuatable and runs it. I am relatively new to the scene and don't
know where to find stuff. I am particularly interested in the ELF side
of things. i already have a lot of info on the ELF file format but I
would like to have a look at the source for the loader. Is it relativly
the same for all distro's? I am particluarly interested in Redhat.
thanks.
dan
ps. can you cc to my email thanks.
------------------------------
From: "Thomas Hunt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: vfat filesystem support in 2.3.51 kernel
Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2000 22:23:12 -0400
I'm starting to get into Kernel development for Linux, so I upgraded to the
2.3.51 kernel, and I can't access the vfat drives in my computer. When I try
to mount the drive, I get a message saying that my kernel doesn't support
the vfat filesystem. I'm pretty sure I've found the source for vfat support
(in the /usr/src/linux/fs/vfat folder) but I'm not sure how to implement it.
If you can help me out I'd really appreciate it.
--
-Thomas Hunt([EMAIL PROTECTED])
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kaz Kylheku)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,linux.dev.c-programming,linux.redhat.development
Subject: Re: Partition Access
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 02:39:25 GMT
On Sun, 02 Apr 2000 20:23:36 GMT, Someone Insignificant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>of the device, the number of blocks on the device. Also, standard calls to
>the C library lseek() function are limited to a maximum of 2 gig.
The Linux operating system has a 64 bit version of the lseek system call. It's
not in the library but you can create your own system call stub for it:
#include <syscall.h>
typedef long long loff_t;
_syscall5(int, _llseek, int, fd, unsigned long, hi, unsigned long, lo,
loff_t *, res, int, wh)
int _llseek(int fd, unsigned long offset_high, unsigned long offset_low,
loff_t * result, int whence);
Read the llseek man page, if you have it.
--
#exclude <windows.h>
------------------------------
From: Graham Stoney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: gnu.gcc.help
Subject: Re: Doing dead function elimination without -finline-functions in
Date: 3 Apr 2000 03:23:23 GMT
Graham Stoney wrote:
> But I'm not trying to eliminate entire .o files; I'm just trying to eliminate
> static functions in each .o which never get called.
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Etienne Lorrain <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Compile with GCC option -ffunction-sections, which put every functions
> in their own section, rewrite the linker description file to put all
> sections ".text.<functionname>" in the ".text" segment, and more important
> "ask to binutil" / "send them a patch" to accept the flag --gc-section
> for the i386 target and process it as it is documented (ld manual).
Interesting approach! Sounds even better than what I was hoping for, since
this should also eliminate non-static functions which are never called, even
if others in the same .o file are. Thank you, I'll give it a try.
Regards,
Graham
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (John C. Peterson)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.portable
Subject: RFD: comp.os.linux.embedded
Date: 3 Apr 2000 03:45:18 GMT
[This is a reposting of an official RFD currently
being discussed in news.groups]
REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD)
unmoderated group comp.os.linux.embedded
This is a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) for the creation of a
world-wide unmoderated Usenet newsgroup comp.os.linux.embedded. This
is not a Call for Votes (CFV); you cannot vote at this time.
Procedural details are below.
Newsgroup line:
comp.os.linux.embedded Linux operating system on embedded hardware
RATIONALE: comp.os.linux.embedded
It is becoming apparent that the Linux operating system has a
very bright future in the area of embedded applications; internet
appliances, wireless internet access, personal digital assistants,
television set top boxes, medical instruments, dedicated control
systems, etc. The potential for the growth of Linux in this area is
highlighted by the fact that roughly 95% of all newly manufactured
microcomputer chips are used for embedded applications.
Industry has already embraced Linux for use in embedded applications
for several reasons. The cost of licensing a commercial operating
system and the power of the open source development model are some
of the more prominent ones. The TiVo personal video recorder,
and the Empeg MP3 car player are two examples of consumer products
that utilize embedded Linux. Samsung has recently announced plans to
market the world's first Linux based PDA, named Yopy. Sony already
uses Linux based systems for developing applications for it's
Playstation2 game machine. The industry has further demonstrated
it's commitment to Linux by the recent announcement of the formation
of the Embedded Linux Consortium (ELC). It will consist of roughly
50 member companies including IBM, Lineo, Motorola and Red Hat.
Linux development has historically been oriented toward desktop
and server applications and the current comp.os.linux.* hierarchy
largely reflects this heritage. The unique nature of the technical
issues of using Linux for embedded applications, and the potential
for enormous growth are the two main reasons for the proposal of
this new Usenet newsgroup.
There will be some overlap of the charter of the proposed group
will that of the existing comp.os.linux.portable newsgroup. This
is unavoidable since some embedded devices are designed with the
intent to provide portable computing resources of a rather general
nature (PDAs for example). However, the universe of embedded devices
that would not be classified as a portable computer is very large
(e.g. TV set top boxes, medical instruments). It is the contention of
the proponent that the proposed group is sufficiently disjoint from
the existing comp.os.linux.portable newsgroup that the efficiency
and viability of both groups would not be negatively impacted.
Topics related to the use of Linux on embedded processors are
already frequently discussed in several existing Usenet newsgroups
and mailing lists. Statistics for such postings during the period
from Jan 1, 2000 to Jan 31, 2000 are shown in the table below. The
Usenet statistics were gathered using "Power" keyword searches
from the Deja search engine at http://www.deja.com/home_ps.shtml
Newsgroup / Mailing List Posts Search Keyword
======================== ===== ====== =======
comp.arch.embedded 151 "Linux"
comp.dsp 41 "Linux"
comp.realtime 24 "Linux"
comp.os.linux.development.system 17 "embedded"
comp.os.linux.hardware 8 "embedded"
uclinux mailing list 135 N.A.
---
Total Postings 376
Average / Day 12 (376/31)
CHARTER: comp.os.linux.embedded
The proposed newsgroup is intended to be a public forum for the
discussion of the development and use of the Linux operating system
on embedded hardware platforms. Topics considered appropriate for
posting to the group might include (but are not limited to);
o Software Related Topics
+ Embedded Linux distributions (e.g. Lineo Embedix, Mobile Linux)
+ Software APIs for embedded Linux development (e.g. Cygnus EL/IX)
+ Development of user applications for embedded Linux
+ Integrated Development Environments for embedded Linux
o Hardware Related Topics
+ Linux based emulators and debuggers for embedded hardware
+ Existing Linux support for specific hardware
+ Development of device drivers for embedded Linux
Topics that might appear welcome on the surface, but in fact are not
include; general questions about embedded hardware with no reference
to Linux, questions about embedded or real time programming that
are not specific to Linux, such as "What is multithreading?", or
"What is a deadlock?", etc.
One time postings of commercial product announcements or postings of
a commercial nature that are replies to another posted inquiry will
be considered appropriate. However, as in most other Usenet groups,
repeated or in-discriminant posting of commercial advertisements will
be prohibited. Postings using MIME, HTML formats are discouraged
since many Usenet readers do not use web browsers. The posting of
source code and binaries for the purpose of distribution shall be
prohibited. However, a small snippet of source code or a small patch
would be considered acceptable.
END CHARTER.
PROCEDURE:
This is a request for discussion, not a call for votes. In this phase
of the process, any potential problems with the proposed newsgroups
should be raised and resolved. The discussion period will continue
for a minimum of 21 days (starting from when the first RFD for this
proposal is posted to news.announce.newgroups), after which a Call For
Votes (CFV) may be posted by a neutral vote taker if the discussion
warrants it. Please do not attempt to vote until this happens.
All discussion of this proposal should be posted to news.groups.
This RFD attempts to comply fully with the Usenet newsgroup creation
guidelines outlined in "How to Create a New Usenet Newsgroup" and "How
to Format and Submit a New Group Proposal". Please refer to these
documents (available in news.announce.newgroups) if you have any
questions about the process.
DISTRIBUTION:
This RFD has been posted to the following newsgroups:
news.announce.newgroups
news.groups
comp.os.linux.announce
comp.os.linux.development.system
comp.os.linux.portable
comp.arch.embedded
comp.dsp
This RFD has been posted to the following mailing lists;
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (discussion of Linux on systems without a MMU)
To subscribe, send a mail message to <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
with 'subscribe uclinux' in the body of the mail message
Proponent: John Peterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--
___|___ | John C. Peterson, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | "Once you have flown,
-(*)- | you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there
o/ \o | you have been, there you long to return." -- Leonardo da Vinci.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 21:10:38 -0600
From: "D. Stimits" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: not able to get changes after kernel build
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Hello,
> In kernel's(2.2.12) source there is file /net/ipv4/protocol.c which
> includes one routine called inet_get_protocol. But
> the /include/net/protocol.h have no prototype for the same. Because of
> which I am not able to use this routine. To make use of this I have
> inserted the same into .h file and rebuild the kernel. After this also
> I am getting the error as 'inet_getprotocol symbol not found'. Can
> anyone tell me how to do this ?
> Thanks in advance,
> Bhagyashree
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
After a kernel compile, you might want to make sure that your
/usr/src/linux/System.map file is copied to the right place, usually
/boot/. If you already have a System.map file that is located in the
search path, and occurs before /boot/ (I think the root itself, "/",
applies), then you'll need to remove the old one, preferably by
backing it up or gzipping it (an easy way to deactivate, store, and
preserve, all in one step).
------------------------------
From: Michael A Uman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Help with ostringstream...
Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 04:25:20 GMT
Does anyone know where in the Linux libraries the 'ostringstream' class
is defined? I cannot find it in the GNU gcc include files.
Please advise?
Thanks,
Michael Uman
------------------------------
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