Linux-Development-Sys Digest #876, Volume #7 Thu, 18 May 00 23:13:15 EDT
Contents:
APM_CPU_IDLE (Yung-Hsiang Lu)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Leslie Mikesell)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Steve)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Steve)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Victor Wagner)
Re: Kernel panic: aic7xxx: unrecoverable BRKADRINT. In swapper task - not syncing.
(Ed Moore)
Re: Why no defrag? ("Robert L.")
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (David T. Blake)
Re: Signal in Linux? (Charles Blackburn)
Re: linux kernel not C++ friendly? (Stefaan A Eeckels)
Re: linux kernel not C++ friendly? (Kaz Kylheku)
Re: porting NT device drivers to linux (Christian Winter)
Re: linux kernel not C++ friendly? (Kaz Kylheku)
Re: MS caught breaking web sites ("SUDDN")
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Doug Alcorn)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Yung-Hsiang Lu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: APM_CPU_IDLE
Date: 18 May 2000 22:18:26 GMT
Hi,
Did anybody turn on CONFIG_APM_CPU_IDLE while configuring kernel? How
much power did it save? It seems to me that the implementation
(linux-2.3-99/arch/i386/kernel/apm.c) itself is not quite efficient.
For example, apm_mainloop sets a timer for one second. That means CPU
has to run it every second. Also, static apm_cpu_idle doesn't seem to
be called from anywhere.
Am I missing anything? Please share your experience. Thanks!
--
Sincerely,
Yung-Hsiang Lu
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Date: 18 May 2000 17:56:58 -0500
In article <8g1k4e$qes$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Peter T. Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>: But, for a RH system, the RH placements are standard. This turns
>: out to be an acquired taste. Back when it was hard to find up to
>: date RPMs for everything and many programs needed local tuning to
>: work right, it was kind of annoying to have my custom-compiled
>: programs land in /usr/local/ while the stock RH versions of the
>: same thing did not use /usr/local at all. However, now that just
>: about everything in the world is already built as an up-to-date RH
>: oriented rpm and I only have a few things in /usr/local, I
>: am starting to like it that way.
>
>I've been using debian sources for too long now to remember what I used
>to have to undo in the RH ones. I think it was config files that didn't
>go into /etc but instead some place in /usr/lib.
RH puts all config files in etc, even the ones that don't really
belong there. For example /usr/lib/X11/lib/xinit is a symlink to
./../../../etc/X11/xinit.
>I use /usr/local for things that weren't in my original system and
>aren't likely to be in it for the foreseeable future. Netscape would
>be an example, though I can't think of any good ones.
On an stock rpm-installed Redhat - and Mandrake:
/usr/bin/netscape
/usr/bin/netscape-communicator
/usr/bin/netscape-navigator
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steve)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 19 May 2000 00:07:39 GMT
On Wed, 17 May 2000 14:39:01 GMT, martin wrote:
>On Tue, 16 May 2000 23:47:56 GMT, Mongoose <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote :
>
>>Hello,
>> I am attempting to start a college project and have two of my
>>ideas already being worked on. So I wanted to know what other people
>>had for suggestions for linux projects? I was thinking of something
>>along the lines of a project that would help promote the use of linux.
>>What is something that most people could use? Something that could
>>make a good 1 year R&D project?
>
>How about an easy-to-use text editor ? (console, not GUI please :) ?
>One without a million complex commands, but with ability to select
>text with shift+arrow keys, like most dos/windows/os2-based editors
>do, F2 to save a file instead of Ctrl-x + Ctrl-s or something and
>those other features that are standard on other operating systems.
>
>Basically, a simple editor that doesn't need a 300-page tutorial.
>I can't find any of those in linux. Not for console anyway.
I'd second this, even Nedit doesn't fit the bill, what we want is just
Pico with the ability to copy and paste and cut with shift and arrow
keys, and F keys to do simple things like save, save as and exit etc.
--
Cheers
Steve email mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
%HAV-A-NICEDAY Error not enough coffee 0 pps.
web http://www.ndirect.co.uk/~sjlen/
or http://start.at/zero-pps
4:10pm up 1 day, 15 min, 3 users, load average: 1.26, 1.19, 1.09
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steve)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 19 May 2000 00:07:40 GMT
On 18 May 2000 06:20:59 GMT, Koos Pol wrote:
>On Wed, 17 May 2000 14:39:01 GMT, martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>|
>| How about an easy-to-use text editor ? (console, not GUI please :) ?
>| One without a million complex commands, but with ability to select
>| text with shift+arrow keys, like most dos/windows/os2-based editors
>| do, F2 to save a file instead of Ctrl-x + Ctrl-s or something and
>| those other features that are standard on other operating systems.
>|
>| Basically, a simple editor that doesn't need a 300-page tutorial.
>| I can't find any of those in linux. Not for console anyway.
>|
>|
>| --
>| Martin
>
>
>Oh yes you can! Try FTE. It does exactly all what you requested :-)
>http://fte.sourceforge.net/
>
It doesn't run in the xterm that you're currently in, and if I remember
it kept insisting on opening a window that was too big for the screen,
and changing the default colours was a nightmare, I gave up with it
in the end.
--
Cheers
Steve email mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
%HAV-A-NICEDAY Error not enough coffee 0 pps.
web http://www.ndirect.co.uk/~sjlen/
or http://start.at/zero-pps
4:10pm up 1 day, 15 min, 3 users, load average: 1.26, 1.19, 1.09
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Victor Wagner)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Date: 18 May 2000 09:50:55 +0400
In comp.os.linux.misc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
: Mongoose <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
:> I was thinking, maybe not just servers and stuff, but an application
:> that windows users have but linux doesn't. Something that would give
:> windows users more of an incentive to move to linux, or help them
:> migrate to linux.
: The way I see it, Linux needs the following, at minimum, before it can
: be a legitimate competitor to Windows:
: 1. A streamlined, easy install process;
Disagree. System should be installed by competent techinicans in
computer shops. Windows is not any more easy to install than say
Mandrake 7.0, only user do it much more frequently, so get used to it.
: 2. An office suite roughly as functional as Office, and at least as
: easy to use;
But based on quite diferent ideas - it shouldn't be so bloated and
should have ability to use its components in scripts, and add own
components written as simple scripts or C programs to common GUI.
: 3. A GUI package installation mechanism that's as easy to use as
: InstallShield (trivial if we get a file manager for GNOME or KDE); and
Whats wrong with capt?
: 4. A GUI interface to the most common configuration files.
Never, never, never let user who doesn't understand things tweak the
config files. For such users remote sysadmin service via SSH should be
provided.
: In order to beat Windows, client-side, we need:
: 1. A GUI interface to *all* configuration files;
I've expressed my opinion above. I'd prefer something like expert system
- somethig which allows to ask question on natural language, and answer
with extracts of man and howto. NO GUI - interface just like micq, but
much more interactivity than stupid office equipment in MS Office
2000.
: 2. Integration of all Linux documentation into a centralized,
: searchable help center;
Whats wrong with dwww?
: 3. A DirectX-like platform for hardware-accelerated devices, not
: necessarily at the kernel level;
Whats wrong with OpenGL?
: 4. Abstraction of many protocols and features, ala ODBC (which I hate
: because it never works, not because it's a bad idea); and
Whats wrong with
1. ODBC?
2. DBI/DBD?
: 4. A "killer app." Unfortately, the odds of this being in the office
: suite are about zero, as MS has far too much of an edge on this
: front. The GIMP, with a few unique features, may have the
: potential to get there.
Given Adobe PhotoShop for Linux coming in half a year?
No, if apache is not killer app, you'll have to invent totally new way
of using computers.
But I can give you an idea - some canvas which can be used just is
people use a piece of page - write text, write formulas (and they will
be calculated), draw graphs (and they will be aproximated by formula),
draw arbitrary drawing, and replace hand-drawn objects with exact
gometry shape if desired.
and all the thing could be converted to well-enough printable form (no
better quality than Word gives) with few mouse clicks.
Most people would say, hey, this is Word, Excel and MathCad in one
window, becouse they don't really need neither Word, nor Excel, nor
MathCad - they need to write simple text, compute simple expressions and
draw simple graphs. Now MS give them feature-bloated programs, most of
features of which they never learn, but they consume their hard disk
space but no professional would use them becouse of poor output quality,
and OpenSource gives them Lisp and TeX and Emacs, which require
considerable learning to do anything at all, although if you spend
enough time learning, you get quality output.
: Linux has survived largely because its only real competitor,
: reliability- and performance-wise, was NT, which few "regular" people
: liked because it runs about as many Windows programs as Linux. But
: with Windows 2000 out, suddenly the "mainstream" Windows is comparably
: stable and feature-laden. I think that, unless Linux starts playing
: catch-up in a big way, we're going to be relegated to the niche market
: we've been, until recently, exclusively a part of.
: I suppose that now I'm going to have to get Linux running again so I
: can put my programming hours where my mouth is. (Reason I'm not using
: it now? The fucking Aureal Vortex 2 drivers are (a) non-free; and (b)
: unusably poor.)
: --
: Eric P. McCoy ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
: non-combatant, n. A dead Quaker.
: - Ambrose Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_
--
���� ��������� �� �������� ���������� ������������ �����.
--- �.�. ���
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ed Moore)
Crossposted-To: linux.redhat.install
Subject: Re: Kernel panic: aic7xxx: unrecoverable BRKADRINT. In swapper task - not
syncing.
Date: 18 May 2000 23:41:38 GMT
Reinhold J. Gerharz" > (PostNoEmail<[EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: > The above is the error I get on the first screen when trying to install
: Red
: > Hat Linux 6.2
: >
: > Any ideas what it means?
: >
: > Thanks!
: PS. Oops! Forgot to mention: Its on an EISA 486 PC with AHA-2742, ATI Ultra
: Graphics Pro, and slot 4 is vacant. The PC just locks up!
This is the behavior observed on HP NetServer LC EISA Pentium systems
with onboard SCSI equivalent to AHA-2740.
: PPS. RH Linux 6.1 installed just fine...
Likewise on the NetServers. RH 5.2 had a similar installation problem
with AHA-2740, but RH quickly released a new boot diskette that solved
that problem. RH has an updated boot diskette for 6.2 at
<http://www.redhat.com/support/errata/RHBA-2000010-01.html>, but it
does not help on the systems I've tried.
------------------------------
From: "Robert L." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.apps
Subject: Re: Why no defrag?
Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 00:54:38 GMT
"Harald Finster" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a �crit dans le message news:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Frank wrote:
> >
> > Miquel van Smoorenburg <8g0kf3$mbv$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
> > ^
> > ^ Still someone wrote one. It's called e2defrag. There are at least
> > ^ redhat and debian packages for it. I've never used it since there is
> > ^ no need for it, but it does exist.
> > ^
> >
> > I suppose anyone can write one:
> >
> > int main(void)
> > {
> > fprintf(stdout, "Defragmenting drives... ");
> > sleep(900);
> > fprintf(stdout, "done\n");
> > return(0);
> > }
>
>
> No, no, absolutely insufficient:
> You should at least add a few read/write operations causing
> head-movements, so that the user has the impression, that
> defrag is heavily working :-)
>
> Harald
>
> --
> Harald Finster
> -
> Windoze can be used on the North-Pole without any problems,
> ... because a frozen computer can't freeze
int main()
{
printf("Starting the defrag");
system("find / > /tmp/find");/* maybe 2-3 time */
printf("Defrag is finish");
return 0;
}
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David T. Blake)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Date: 19 May 2000 00:09:24 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >Basically, a simple editor that doesn't need a 300-page tutorial.
> >I can't find any of those in linux. Not for console anyway.
>
> I'd second this, even Nedit doesn't fit the bill, what we want is just
> Pico with the ability to copy and paste and cut with shift and arrow
> keys, and F keys to do simple things like save, save as and exit etc.
Try microemacs and redefine the function keys to be
the functions you want.
http://www.keck.ucsf.edu/~dblake/programs/
89k binary
However, I would recommend learning the readline key bindings
anyway. They are ubiquitious in linux/Unix systems.
--
Dave Blake
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Charles Blackburn)
Subject: Re: Signal in Linux?
Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 22:23:57 +0100
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 17 May 2000 09:23:12 GMT, Alger wrote:
> I would like to know about the signal handling in Linux.
> Can the daemon program recevie the signal (such as SIGTERM?).
> I try one daemon (written by me) and find it cannot work ?
> Do anyone have the same experience ?
works fine here.
how are you doing the signal handling? are you using the signal(...) system
call etc??
If you like, I can post some example code.
--
Charles Blackburn -=- Remove NOSPAM to email a reply.
Summerfield Technology Limited - SuSE Linux Reseller & Birmingham L.U.G sponsor
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
10:09pm up 3:41, 1 user, load average: 0.06, 0.17, 0.08
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Stefaan A Eeckels)
Subject: Re: linux kernel not C++ friendly?
Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 00:41:33 +0200
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Travis Hein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I am very new to this linux world, and the art of building kernel modules.
> I noticed when i ran the c++ compiler on even the most trivial of kernel
> modules, some kernel include files make use of c++ predefined operators, like
> new, class, etc.
>
> Thus leading me to wonder, if a kernel module could not be developed using C++
> classes and structures?
Short answer: No.
Medium sized answer: You could, but you'd have to provide all the
run time support usually provided by C++'s support libraries, and
libc. You don't want to do this.
Long answer: OO is not a panacea. No language is, and ever will be.
When given a problem to solve, the good programmer will select the
tools best suited to the problem, which in case of Linux kernel
modules is 'C', because the kernel is written in 'C', and all
the mechanisms are in place for 'C' modules.
Whatever time you might save through C++ (if any) you'll have to
spend a hundredfold on developing the kernel equivalents of the
C++ runtime libraries.
If you insist on an OS written in C++, try FreeBeOS.
--
Stefaan
--
--PGP key available from PGP key servers (http://www.pgp.net/pgpnet/)--
Ninety-Ninety Rule of Project Schedules:
The first ninety percent of the task takes ninety percent of
the time, and the last ten percent takes the other ninety percent.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kaz Kylheku)
Subject: Re: linux kernel not C++ friendly?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 02:09:14 GMT
On Fri, 19 May 2000 00:41:33 +0200, Stefaan A Eeckels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Travis Hein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> I am very new to this linux world, and the art of building kernel modules.
>> I noticed when i ran the c++ compiler on even the most trivial of kernel
>> modules, some kernel include files make use of c++ predefined operators, like
>> new, class, etc.
>>
>> Thus leading me to wonder, if a kernel module could not be developed using C++
>> classes and structures?
>Short answer: No.
>
>Medium sized answer: You could, but you'd have to provide all the
>run time support usually provided by C++'s support libraries, and
>libc. You don't want to do this.
I see. So it follows that to use C for writing kernel code,
you would also need to provide all the run time support normally
provided by a hosted implementation of C.
--
#exclude <windows.h>
------------------------------
From: Christian Winter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: porting NT device drivers to linux
Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 23:28:38 +0200
Grant Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> schrob:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Mario Klebsch wrote:
>>I would not make two modules, if I am not forced to do so. I would put it
>>all into a single module. If your drivers needs both modules to work
>>properly, you will gain nothing in splitting them. But you will have the
>>additional trouble of getting both modules loaded.
> It might be appropriate to split the functionality into an actual kernel
> driver module and a shared library that provides higher-level functionality
> on top of the driver-implimented system calls.
Some similar discussion was on the linux-usb mailing list recently, with
all of the "really expirienced" programmers as I'd call them (like Alain
Cox) agreeing that there should be the minimum of functionality in the
kernel module that is needed to talk to a device, while all data operation
(transformation etc.) should be done using a library. This has the big
opportunity of enhancing functionality without having to recompile the
kernel.
If I remember it right the topic was a driver for usb-tv-cards and
whether YUV-RGB-conversion should be done in the kernel modulmodulee.
Regards
Christian
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kaz Kylheku)
Subject: Re: linux kernel not C++ friendly?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 02:40:43 GMT
On Fri, 19 May 2000 00:41:33 +0200, Stefaan A Eeckels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Travis Hein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> I am very new to this linux world, and the art of building kernel modules.
>> I noticed when i ran the c++ compiler on even the most trivial of kernel
>> modules, some kernel include files make use of c++ predefined operators, like
>> new, class, etc.
>>
>> Thus leading me to wonder, if a kernel module could not be developed using C++
>> classes and structures?
>Short answer: No.
>
>Medium sized answer: You could, but you'd have to provide all the
>run time support usually provided by C++'s support libraries, and
>libc. You don't want to do this.
I just wrote a module in C++ and it loaded just nicely into 2.2.12.
Here is the module:
#include <stddef.h>
#include <linux/config.h>
#include <linux/module.h>
#include <linux/kernel.h>
void *operator new (size_t) {
}
void operator delete (void *ptr) {
}
class myclass {
public:
myclass() { printk(KERN_INFO "myclass::myclass\n"); }
~myclass() { printk(KERN_INFO "myclass::~myclass\n"); }
};
extern "C" int init_module()
{
myclass dummy;
printk(KERN_INFO "foo_init\n");
return 0;
}
extern "C" void cleanup_module()
{
myclass dummy;
printk(KERN_INFO "foo_cleanup\n");
}
I compiled this with g++ -fno-exceptions -D__KERNEL__ -DMODULE test.cc -c
When I insert it into the kernel, it produces trace messages indicating
that the dummy objects are being constructed and destroyed.
What library features am I missing? Are you saying I need things like
<iostream> or the STL in order to use C++? That's not true any more than
that I need strftime(), qsort(), frexp() or wcstombs() in order to do kernel
programming in C.
Note: I would have completed the definitions of operators new and delete to
call kmalloc and kfree, but adding the right headers barfs the compiler. As a
workaround, I could make wrappers in a separate translation unit written in C
and call those wrappers from the C++ one. Then use the linker to combine the
two .o's into one. In general, I could create a C++ friendly interface wrapper
around just about anything in the kernel, though the real solution is to make
the headers be acceptable as C++.
--
#exclude <windows.h>
------------------------------
From: "SUDDN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.linux.networking,comp.os.linux.security,comp.os.ms-windows.networking.tcp-ip,alt.conspiracy.area51
Subject: Re: MS caught breaking web sites
Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 02:54:40 GMT
I am no fan of Microcrap but this turned out not to be a backdoor at all.
Too bad.... I would have loved to see Microcrap get grabbed by the knarlies!
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: Doug Alcorn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 03:00:25 GMT
Prasanth Kumar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Doug Alcorn wrote:
> >
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JEDIDIAH) writes:
> > > >
> > > >First, the Qt library _is_ now free. Trolltech decided to license it
> > >
> > > It's 'kinda' free. It's still owned by Trolltech.
> >
> > OK, I stand corrected. I really don't think their license is as free
> > as other licenses (although the Open Source Group. With that said,
> > the ownership of the code as little to do with its freedom. The
> > freedom is all in the license. Ghostscript is a good example of free
> > software that is exclusively owned by Aladin Software.
>
> Can you elaborate in what way the QPL is less free than the GPL?
>
I thought I did elaborate. My next paragraph talked about the
limitations of TrollTech being the only one who can distribute derived
works. Or rather, your derived works must be distributed through
trolltech.
--
(__) Doug Alcorn (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.lathi.net)
oo / Win a 66MB capacity tape drive. Help me win too!
|_/ http://www.ecrix.com/extreme/getReferrals.cfm?ref=7612
------------------------------
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