Linux-Development-Sys Digest #897, Volume #7 Tue, 23 May 00 23:13:11 EDT
Contents:
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: What !@#$ moron colorised g++? (Matthew Palmer)
Re: DEB: minimum install for compile (Matthew Palmer)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Matthias Warkus)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (David Steuber)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (David Steuber)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (JEDIDIAH)
Re: Checking for I'm swapped - number of pages swapped out (Kevin Buhr)
Re: high resolution timer? (Robert Redelmeier)
urgent about device driver (Kai Li)
urgent device driver (Kai Li)
Final PHP-4 RPM binaries? ("Tom")
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (David Steuber)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (David Steuber)
2.2.15 and 2.3.99 USB-Backport and no mouse (Konstantinos Agouros)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 20:10:25 GMT
Someone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>How can I spin down my SCSI drives when they are not in use? I've
>been after that for years.
And in all those years, you never went to Google and typed
scsi linux spin down
as your search terms? Because if you did, you'd have found several references
to scsi-idle, and the 9th hit is the "homepage" for it, appropriately titled
"Starting and Stopping SCSI drives under linux".
Or you go to Freshmeat, and enter
scsi spin down
in the search box --- and number 6, "noflushd", is what you are after.
It describes how to handle SCSI disks in its README file.
Now, granted, it sounds like neither solution is completely stable with
the latest development kernels (the last time I used scsi-idle was in '96),
but at least it's there, and it's fairly easy to find.
Bernie
--
Gentleman, I am a Catholic... If you reject me on account of my
religion, I shall thank God that He has spared me the indignity of
being your representative
Hilaire Belloc
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matthew Palmer)
Subject: Re: What !@#$ moron colorised g++?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 23 May 2000 20:43:56 +1000
[EMAIL PROTECTED] is of the opinion:
>now. But it would exist even if Microsoft did not. It's all part of the
>dumbing down of computing. The real problem is that it is being coupled
>with uniformity that forces everyone to the least common denominator.
Oh yes. We could be here for hours listing the examples of that - RedHat's
linuxconf is the latest and greatest that I've seen...
I think it's the first example of a linux virus/worm/trojan - you try to get
rid of it, but it just keeps coming back somehow...
>| This I think is a praticular case in point. Programmers are supposed
>| to be expert users. What do they need to have error messages colorised
>| for? Frankly I don't want to see people who need crutches like having
>| the error message, file name, and file line number in different colors
>| programming for Linux. And the !@#$%^& colorisation is screwing
>| me up.
>
>For some people that may be an advantage. I do find the messages from
>a huge make from my 600+ function library to be very cluttered, and would
>jump at ways to make errors easy to detect. I use -Werror to just make
If you're getting several error messages from different modules you need to
be programming more incrementally.
>| I can't use next-error. Can anyone help me to fix this?
>
>The key is there needs to be a way to turn it off. Once that is in place
>then the debate is whether it should default on or off and I would not
>have a problem with either course on that.
Definitely.
I must admit that I haven't seen this behaviour on my particular gcc/g++
(2.95.2, IIRC) but if it arrives, I either turn it off or downgrade. I am
*not* having colour in my errors, just like I don't have colours in my
source code.
--
=======================================================================
#include <disclaimer.h>
Matthew Palmer
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matthew Palmer)
Subject: Re: DEB: minimum install for compile
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 23 May 2000 20:37:43 +1000
[EMAIL PROTECTED] is of the opinion:
>Hi anyone know what minimum .deb install + order of install
>I need to compile on debian 2.2. At the moment I got errors
>compiling c, such as ld cannot find crt0.o or something like that..
>I guess I'm missing some library .deb
libc6-dev
gcc
Plus anything these packages depend on.
>email any answers to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Post here, read here.
--
=======================================================================
#include <disclaimer.h>
Matthew Palmer
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matthias Warkus)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 16:20:23 +0200
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It was the Tue, 23 May 2000 08:59:59 GMT...
...and David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The right is non-exlusive. That means everyone can get that right. I
> think TrollTech is just trying to prevent forking of the Qt library
> here.
Exactly that is which is bad IMHO. Real software freedom has always
been the freedom to fork.
mawa
--
The utility of a fancy Web browser is damn near zero compared with the
utility of a really good text editor.
-- mawa
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 22:59:59 GMT
Someone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
' Mr Steuber is an excellent example of my point. In my message can't you
' tell I LIKE linux, I have Linux, I have used Linux for several years. It
' is a great hobby to configure but once it is working what are you going to
' use it for? Why don't any of the free ISPs support Linux? That would be
No, I could not tell.
I also don't see how support by free ISPs is any kind of indicator of
the quality of technology. I wouldn't touch those free ISPs with a 20
meter, high voltage catle prod.
As for what are you going to use if for, you are clearly limited by
your imagination. What is it you are doing on Windows? Why can't you
do it with Linux or *BSD?
I spend a fair amount of my leasure time on usenet and mail. Linux
seems to do those functions pretty well. I also develop software.
Linux seems to have some pretty good tools for that too. Linux also
seems to have more text processing tools than non-unix type systems.
Also, there is at least one good image processing tool for Linux.
There are also tools for digital signal processing, content
distribution, type setting, data storage and retrieval, network
management, network services, security, data encryption, numerical
analysis, etc, etc, etc.
It seems to me that anything you could possibly want to do on a
computer can be done on Linux. If some feature is missing, the tools
are provided to implement it. Saying that you can't do anything on
Linux is utterly absurd.
--
David Steuber | Hi! My name is David Steuber, and I am
NRA Member | a hoploholic.
All bits are significant. Some bits are more significant than others.
-- Charles Babbage Orwell
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 22:59:58 GMT
Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
' the problem isn't with the install, it's when you go to remove or
' upgrade. sometimes it's hard (or at least tedious) to figure out what
' all things went where. then when you find a random file, you wonder
' where it came from. rpm doesn't really solve the shared config
' tweaks very well (like editing an init script to set something up
' while leaving setup for other stuff). rpm is clunky and sometimes a
' pain in the ass, but it's not completely useless to me.
It should be possible to automate some dependency and file use
information with a script, ldd, and possibly some other utilities that
can figure out what names are passed to a dlopen() call. Basicly,
take a census of all the file information based on the files
themselves rather than relying on some spec file to be set up
correctly.
When you find some random file, you should be able to find out what,
if anything, references it. If nothing references it, then you should
be able to garbage collect it.
--
David Steuber | Hi! My name is David Steuber, and I am
NRA Member | a hoploholic.
All bits are significant. Some bits are more significant than others.
-- Charles Babbage Orwell
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JEDIDIAH)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 23:04:10 GMT
On Tue, 23 May 2000 16:20:23 +0200, Matthias Warkus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>It was the Tue, 23 May 2000 08:59:59 GMT...
>...and David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> The right is non-exlusive. That means everyone can get that right. I
>> think TrollTech is just trying to prevent forking of the Qt library
>> here.
>
>Exactly that is which is bad IMHO. Real software freedom has always
>been the freedom to fork.
Common communications standards should be free to propagate
on their own onto any and every platform that has users that
care to communicate.
Also, a 'compatibility standard' becomes more valuable the more
people that use it. I've always thought that Troll would be
better served with a lib that was given away to all but devtools
that EVERYONE would be willing to pay for.
--
In what language does 'open' mean 'execute the evil contents of' |||
a document? --Les Mikesell / | \
Need sane PPP docs? Try penguin.lvcm.com.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kevin Buhr)
Subject: Re: Checking for I'm swapped - number of pages swapped out
Date: 23 May 2000 18:17:14 -0500
"Dmitry A. Antipov" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> O.K, may be my first question was unaccurate :-(. I' looking for the way
> to count
> number of swapped out pages. Is this code piece correct or not ?
>
> void foo (pid_t pid) {
> struct rusage rusg;
> ptrace (PTRACE_ATTACH, pid, ...);
> getrusage (RUSAGE_CHILDREN, &rusg);
> printf ("%d pages swapped out for %u\n", rusg.ru_nswap, pid);
> ptrace (PTRACE_DETACH, pid, ...);
> }
Obviously, you didn't try it. This won't work for two reasons.
First, the child resource usage information is only credited to the
parent when a child exits, not when a new child is forked or attached.
Second, the "ru_nswap" quantity refers to the total number of swapout
events that have occurred during the life of the process, not the
number of pages currently swapped out.
Unfortunately, the kernel (at least 2.2.14) doesn't have a statistic
dedicated to counting swapped out pages. Worse yet, it doesn't appear
to provide quite enough other information to calculate it.
What are trying to do with this information? Maybe there's some other
statistic that would give you what you need.
Kevin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
------------------------------
From: Robert Redelmeier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: high resolution timer?
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 18:24:05 -0500
David Peter wrote:
>
> Not much good I'm afraid. This typically gives resolution only down to
> 10ms or so. I'm looking for something in the microsecond or nanosecond
> range.
Well, if you're running 586+, then you can always use the `rdtsc`
instruction to read the 64 bit CPU clock counter. On a 500 MHz
CPU, that will give you 2 ns resolution.
But all is not sweetness and light. First, you have to rather
arbitarily fix a certain clockcount to gettimeofday() that is only
usually precise to 10 ms. The trifling 32 clock overhead for the
RDTSC instruction pales next to a typical HW interrupt overhead
of 1000-5000 clocks. And there is variation due to cache states,
not to mention higher-priority tasks.
But if all you want is elapsed time for instructions, or you can live
with 10 us jitter on your interrupt timing, then RDTSC will work.
-- Robert
------------------------------
From: Kai Li <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: urgent about device driver
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 16:25:36 -0700
Hi! there,
I need a Ethernet NIC card for my linux and also source code for this
driver. where could i get such card attached with the source code?
Greatly appreciate any help and hint..
Robert,
------------------------------
From: Kai Li <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: urgent device driver
Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 16:32:34 -0700
Hi,
I need one Ethernet NIC card and the source code for my linux. Greatly
appreciate any help and hint..
Robert,
------------------------------
From: "Tom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.networking,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Final PHP-4 RPM binaries?
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 02:42:49 +0100
Does anyone know of any RPM binary installations of the newly released PHP-4
for i386 RedHat 6.x
I've tried www.rpmfind.com without luck.
Thanks.
Tom
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 01:59:59 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell) writes:
' >It makes no difference to an end user what the source license is.
'
' It does make a difference when it makes it impossible to use.
'
' >The Regents of University of California, Berkley choose their
' >license. I get to choose mine.
'
' I'm not arguing about your right to do whatever you want, I
' am just saying that I don't understand what motivates you
' to create a situation where I can download code, have it
' on my machine and use it in any way I want, but only in
' cases where I can do the linking myself. If another needed
' component is controlled by someone else with an equal
' right to choose their license, I won't be able to obtain
' and use the combination together.
Ok, now I am really confused. Could you please give me some example
of where you have two pieces of code that you want to use together,
but can't because of license restrictions?
On my machines, I have code with quite a variety of licenses. Those
include GPL, BSD, QPL, Perl's Artistic License, the TCL license, and a
bunch of others. The base system is GNU/Linux. A bunch of libraries
in use are either GPL or LGPL, including libc.
Have I violated someone's license?
I am not trying to create a situation where you or anyone else can't
use code that I write or code that is derived from code that I write.
I am trying to avoid the situation where improvements to my code are
not returned to me or to others. The whole point of FSF style free
software is to advance the state of the art by not shackling code with
proprietary licensing.
If there is a better way to achieve this goal, please tell me about
it.
--
David Steuber | Hi! My name is David Steuber, and I am
NRA Member | a hoploholic.
All bits are significant. Some bits are more significant than others.
-- Charles Babbage Orwell
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 02:00:00 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell) writes:
' In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
' David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
'
' >Then again, InstallSheild, possibly the best installer in Windows
' >land, is even worse. Go figure.
' >
' >Do people really have trouble with ./configure, make, make install?
' >It has _never_ been a problem for me. Maybe I am just lucky. Even
' >though I changed my compiler, libc, and libtools.
'
' Given a thousand packages, how long does it take you to be sure
' you have the latest version of each installed using this
' technique? How long does it take to figure out what is missing
' when the linker can't resolve a symbol?
RPM is no better at telling me that I have the latest version. When I
go get the source, I look for the latest stable release. The README
file generally tells you where to get the latest version. The INSTALL
file generally tells you what you need on your system already.
I've not had any problems yet. Once a core system is in place,
installing some other package is generally hassle free. It is also
not difficult to modify the core system. I've recompiled libc, the
compiler, and the kernel on my system with out any problems. Nothing
stoped working. The machine did not explode.
I don't use a thousand different packages. If I did, perhaps I would
want something better. Then again, the complexity of the system does
not seem to grow much as packages are added. This is because there
are conventions about where files should go that most packages adhere
too.
I'm happy that Linux gives me the choice of using source distributions
or rpms. Some systems don't give you that choice.
--
David Steuber | Hi! My name is David Steuber, and I am
NRA Member | a hoploholic.
All bits are significant. Some bits are more significant than others.
-- Charles Babbage Orwell
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Konstantinos Agouros)
Subject: 2.2.15 and 2.3.99 USB-Backport and no mouse
Date: 23 May 2000 21:21:42 +0200
Hi,
I tried the above combination and I can't use the mousedev anymore. I took
the kernel-config from 2.2.14/2.3.50-Backport that worked. Anybody has an
idea what might have changed?
Konstantin
--
Dipl-Inf. Konstantin Agouros aka Elwood Blues. Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Otkerstr. 28, 81547 Muenchen, Germany. Tel +49 89 69370185
============================================================================
"Captain, this ship will not sustain the forming of the cosmos." B'Elana Torres
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 02:53:14 GMT
David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> If Windows is so great, why do you have to reboot when you change your
> IP address?
You don't.
--
Eric P. McCoy ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
non-combatant, n. A dead Quaker.
- Ambrose Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 03:01:12 GMT
David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Do people really have trouble with ./configure, make, make install?
> It has _never_ been a problem for me. Maybe I am just lucky. Even
> though I changed my compiler, libc, and libtools.
That precise process usually works out fine. However, a number of
these processes require manual modification of the Makefile or a
custom configuration file. I've also encountered several configure
scripts that break, and when that happens, you're doomed to rewriting
the Makefile by hand. And there are still a few programs that just
provide you with a grab-bag of Makefiles, and you get to pick which
one you want. Those are *always* disasters, but usually the Makefiles
are at least short enough that fixing them isn't impossible.
--
Eric P. McCoy ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
non-combatant, n. A dead Quaker.
- Ambrose Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_
------------------------------
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