Linux-Development-Sys Digest #907, Volume #7 Fri, 26 May 00 01:13:11 EDT
Contents:
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Jonathan Abbey)
Re: 2.2 -> 2.3.99pre9 kernel API changes (Aki M Laukkanen)
Portable dynamic module loadings. (Bill Silverstein)
Re: 2.2 -> 2.3.99pre9 kernel API changes (Timothy J. Lee)
Re: Windows by Day, Linux by Night (Christopher Browne)
Re: HELP: 8 Bit Linux ? (Christopher Browne)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Scott)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: Kernel module-user process comms (Sam Birch)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux (Johan Kullstam)
Re: Kernel module-user process comms (Sam Birch)
Re: Call BIOS from device diver ? (H. Peter Anvin)
Re: Call stack in C (H. Peter Anvin)
Keyboards (Marc Baker)
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jonathan Abbey)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Date: 25 May 2000 16:18:57 -0500
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Nix <$}xinix{[email protected]> wrote:
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JEDIDIAH) writes:
| > Given the non-package specific dependency checking tools already in
| > Linux, one would think that you could build a dependency database
| > quite independent of rpm or deb.
|
| You can. It's called `the filesystem'.
|
| (GNU stow, opt-depot, STORE and similar programs automate this process.)
You can find links to a whole bunch of these things at
http://www.arlut.utexas.edu/csd/opt_depot/opt_depot.html
Jon (one of the primary authors of opt_depot)
--
===============================================================================
Jonathan Abbey [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Applied Research Laboratories The University of Texas at Austin
Ganymede, a GPL'ed metadirectory for UNIX http://www.arlut.utexas.edu/gash2
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Aki M Laukkanen)
Subject: Re: 2.2 -> 2.3.99pre9 kernel API changes
Date: 25 May 2000 21:12:58 GMT
In article <8gjp59$jqb$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Timothy J. Lee wrote:
>At what kernel version did these changes to the network driver API
>occur? (needed for #if in the drivers)
Around 2.3.43.
--
D.
------------------------------
From: Bill Silverstein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Portable dynamic module loadings.
Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 21:35:01 GMT
Has there been a set of libaries done to enable a developer to implement
a common interface to DLL loading on OS/2, Win and loadable modules in
Linux?
This is so I can develop some libaries that are OS blind.
Thanks.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Timothy J. Lee)
Subject: Re: 2.2 -> 2.3.99pre9 kernel API changes
Date: 25 May 2000 22:25:18 GMT
Reply-To: see-signature-for-email-address---junk-not-welcome
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Aki M Laukkanen) writes:
|In article <8gjp59$jqb$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Timothy J. Lee wrote:
|>At what kernel version did these changes to the network driver API
|>occur? (needed for #if in the drivers)
|
|Around 2.3.43.
Comparing the document to 2.3.99pre9 netdevice.h, it looks like
yet more incompatible changes were made (e.g. LINK_STATE_* are
different, and are now __LINK_STATE_* to indicate that they are
supposed to be private). Is there any documentation on the more
recent changes (and when they changed)?
--
========================================================================
Timothy J. Lee timlee@
Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. netcom.com
No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Christopher Browne)
Subject: Re: Windows by Day, Linux by Night
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 23:55:30 GMT
Centuries ago, Nostradamus foresaw a time when Dima Maziuk would say:
>Simone Paddock wrote:
>...
>> As Tim O'Reilly says in "Windows by Day, Linux by Night ":
>> "...because we don't admit to our use of Windows, because
>> it's a guilty secret, we don't spend the kind of time learning
>> how to get the most out of the system.
>...
>
>Well, that's just unprofessional. Did you just say Linux
>promotes un-professionalism? Are you talking to me? ;)
It happens all too often :-(.
>> The first 1000 people who read Tim's article get a free book.
>
>Unfortunately it's a book on Win'98. When I use Windows,
>I use NT.
I've got "my copy" coming; it's liable to bounce around the office a
fair bit. I don't use Win98, and likely never will, but there's a
whole lot of people around the office that _do_, and it could prove
useful to be able to point at a book and say "Here, this is how you
need to do what it is that you want to do..."
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] - <http://www.ntlug.org/~cbbrowne/lsf.html>
The English exam was a piece of cake---which was a bit of a surprise,
actually, because I was expecting some questions on a sheet of paper.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Christopher Browne)
Subject: Re: HELP: 8 Bit Linux ?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 23:55:38 GMT
Centuries ago, Nostradamus foresaw a time when Ronald Cole would say:
>Dan Mathias <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> Is there any 8 Bit Linux or Unix for the 68HC11 or 8088 cpu ?
>
>You might want to look into OS-9. I had a version for my Tandy Color
>Computer 2 (6809E) about 17 years ago. IIRC, Microware owned it then.
>But like UCSD Pascal, I have no clue who owns it now.
As always, <http://www.google.com/> is your friend.
It finds:
<http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~pruyne/os9faq.html>
And the question "Where can I get OS/9?" is answered at:
<http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~pruyne/os9faq.html#microware>
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] - <http://www.ntlug.org/~cbbrowne/>
Rules of the Evil Overlord #223. "I will install a fire extinguisher
in every room -- three, if the room contains vital equipment or
volatile chemicals." <http://www.eviloverlord.com/>
------------------------------
From: Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc
Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 19:31:18 -0400
>I also don't see how support by free ISPs is any kind of indicator of
>the quality of technology. I wouldn't touch those free ISPs with a 20
>meter, high voltage catle prod.
Ahemm...
try www.teledyn.com for a free isp that supports ONLY linux.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
Date: 26 May 2000 00:55:56 GMT
On 23 May 2000 13:07:01 GMT, David T. Blake wrote:
>I was not arguing I should create a library. I was not arguing
>against QTs right to use whatever license they like. I was
>arguing that people should think twice before referring to QT
>licensing as substantially free or "open source".
I find it hard to see how it's not "free" or "open source". I
would definitely agree that it's not the GPL, but the FSF doesn't
have a monopoly on free software ( despite what the name might suggest )
> The right to >fork is absent,
The right to fork is rarely if ever exercised unless the project becomes
unmaintained. Troll have made a sincere effort to address this concern
a long time ago.
> the right not to have your contributions included
>in proprietary works (such as QT Pro) is gone,
(a) I don't see why this is an "advantage". It's a very questionable one.
(b) You have similar issues if you develop LGPL'd software.
(c) It's only true if you are actually working on the QT API itself.
> and QT gets a copy
>of EVERYTHING that even links to their code, even if it is not
>publicly available.
If you're writing free software, the above is a complete non-issue.
--
Donovan
------------------------------
From: Sam Birch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Kernel module-user process comms
Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 01:08:20 GMT
On Thu, 25 May 2000 22:39:45 +0100, Dave Donaghy
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I hope this isn't too stupid a question, but I've read Rubini, and I've
>examined the source code, and I've played around (a lot!) and I'm still
>stuck.
I know what you mean. It is an excellent book, but leaves some
important steps to the readers research/imagination, particularly how
to use its communication instruction from user-space. I have found
that the Linux Kernel Module Hacking Guide compliments it quite well.
I used Rubini's book, the LKMHG, and Beginning Linux Programming
(published by WROX press)...and I also used LXR (http://lxr.linux.no/)
to pour through the kernel code to see what others have done.
I finally was able to impliment the communiation using a proc file and
ioctl's (on the proc file). The proc file read and write gave me the
ability to comminicate with my kernel module from a command line (no
need to compile), but I am only using it to pass text. For anything
dealing with structures, arrays, etc. I use the ioctls. The WROX book
was the best help for the ioctl code (aside from existing kernel
source).
I cannot send you the module code, but if you want to see how I did
it, I could email you snippets of my kernel/user code.
[snipped]
>I stumbled across sys_msgget etc, and got my hopes up, even though these
>things aren't exported to modules. (Re-compiled the kernel and exported
>them before I realised that the reason they're not exported is that
>they're pretty much useless to modules.)
When using the proc file read and write, the functions that fill the
file operations offer you a pointer to a buffer: you can use the read
operation to send text to the user, and you can use the write
operation to accept text from the user (for example, using echo and
cat in userland).
When I defined an ioctl operation for the same proc file (not totally
sure I should do that, but it works), I used copy_from_user() and
copy_to_user() within the function. You can use these to pass just
about any type of data you need to, and it is ideal for coding in
userspace...at least compared to the proc file, anyway.
>Is there anything obvious I'm missing, or do I have to all the work
>myself?
It wasn't obvious to me either, but persistence is the key to success!
I implimented the entire kernel-side code in about 200 lines
(including comments/spacers).
>Dave
Please don't take the following as gospel, since I am a beginner at
kernel hacking...but what I have done works for me.
HTH
Sam
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 01:41:35 GMT
Nix <$}xinix{[email protected]> writes:
> Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > the problem isn't with the install, it's when you go to remove or
> > upgrade. sometimes it's hard (or at least tedious) to figure out what
> > all things went where. then when you find a random file, you wonder
> > where it came from.
>
> GNU stow fixes this pretty well. STORE fixes it far too well (the same
> way as stow) and is so complicated that nobody can work out how to use
> it ;)
>
> If you need external databases to work out where things come from, you
> are in trouble if they get corrupted. If the database is the filesystem
> itself, then that adds no additional points of vulnerability (as you are
> using the fs anyway).
yes but consider a simple program. call it widget.
it's got a man page and config. its executable is
/usr/bin/widget
/usr/man/man1/widget
/etc/widget.cf
notice how the files are scattered all over the filesystem. if the
names are strange or it installs more files, it can get messy fast. i
don't mind them being all over the place, i just want a record of
this. the make install should create a log of what got installed
where. then i could copy this file somewhere and keep track of the
whole widget package. i wish this were a standard feature of people's
makefiles.
i'm not looking for any magic bullets to rescue a broken filesystem, i
just want a little help keeping tracking of what went where.
--
J o h a n K u l l s t a m
[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Don't Fear the Penguin!
------------------------------
From: Sam Birch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Kernel module-user process comms
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 02:41:14 GMT
On Thu, 25 May 2000 22:39:45 +0100, Dave Donaghy
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I hope this isn't too stupid a question, but I've read Rubini, and I've
>examined the source code, and I've played around (a lot!) and I'm still
>stuck.
I know what you mean. It is an excellent book, but leaves some
important steps to the readers research/imagination, particularly how
to use its communication instruction from user-space. I have found
that the Linux Kernel Module Hacking Guide compliments it quite well.
I used Rubini's book, the LKMHG, and Beginning Linux Programming
(published by WROX press)...and I also used LXR (http://lxr.linux.no/)
to pour through the kernel code to see what others have done.
I finally was able to impliment the communiation using a proc file and
ioctl's (on the proc file). The proc file read and write gave me the
ability to comminicate with my kernel module from a command line (no
need to compile), but I am only using it to pass text. For anything
dealing with structures, arrays, etc. I use the ioctls. The WROX book
was the best help for the ioctl code (aside from existing kernel
source).
I cannot send you the module code, but if you want to see how I did
it, I could email you snippets of my kernel/user code.
[snipped]
>I stumbled across sys_msgget etc, and got my hopes up, even though these
>things aren't exported to modules. (Re-compiled the kernel and exported
>them before I realised that the reason they're not exported is that
>they're pretty much useless to modules.)
When using the proc file read and write, the functions that fill the
file operations offer you a pointer to a buffer: you can use the read
operation to send text to the user, and you can use the write
operation to accept text from the user (for example, using echo and
cat in userland).
When I defined an ioctl operation for the same proc file (not totally
sure I should do that, but it works), I used copy_from_user() and
copy_to_user() within the function. You can use these to pass just
about any type of data you need to, and it is ideal for coding in
userspace...at least compared to the proc file, anyway.
>Is there anything obvious I'm missing, or do I have to all the work
>myself?
It wasn't obvious to me either, but persistence is the key to success!
I implimented the entire kernel-side code in about 200 lines
(including comments/spacers).
>Dave
Please don't take the following as gospel, since I am a beginner at
kernel hacking...but what I have done works for me.
HTH
Sam
------------------------------
From: H. Peter Anvin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Call BIOS from device diver ?
Date: 25 May 2000 20:09:44 -0700
Followup to: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
By author: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Aki M Laukkanen)
In newsgroup: comp.os.linux.development.system
>
> http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/amlaukka/vesafb.html
>
> This is a framebuffer device which uses VBE real-mode BIOS calls to
> change display modes. It does this by means of a user mode daemon,
> vesafbd, which receives requests from the kernel. The daemon makes use
> of LRMI (Linux Real Mode Interface) library which is a sort-of mini
> emulator.
>
Note that if your BIOS contains non-V86 compatible features, you're
hosed. Unlikely, I agree, for the VESA real-mode BIOS, but other
BIOSes (e.g. the PXE network BIOSes) does it quite regularly.
-hpa
--
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> at work, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> in private!
"Unix gives you enough rope to shoot yourself in the foot."
------------------------------
From: H. Peter Anvin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Call stack in C
Date: 25 May 2000 20:16:57 -0700
Followup to: <BQPW4.78$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
By author: Joe Ceklosky <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
In newsgroup: comp.os.linux.development.system
>
> How can I get a call stack strace from a
> running program. I want something like pstack
> on Solaris for Linux
>
gdb -p <process_id>
where
-hpa
--
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> at work, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> in private!
"Unix gives you enough rope to shoot yourself in the foot."
------------------------------
From: Marc Baker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Keyboards
Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 03:59:11 GMT
==============52B9D9C97A365ABC7D0E51E1
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Does anyone know of a way to find out what signals are sent from the
multimedia keys on the ever so special multimedia/Internet keyboards we
see so much of these days?
--
Marc Baker
Neil Young on Linux
"Keep On Rockin' in the Free World"
==============52B9D9C97A365ABC7D0E51E1
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
Does anyone know of a way to find out what signals are sent from the multimedia
keys on the ever so special multimedia/Internet keyboards we see so much
of these days?
<pre>--
Marc Baker
Neil Young on Linux
"Keep On Rockin' in the Free World"</pre>
</html>
==============52B9D9C97A365ABC7D0E51E1==
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 04:24:57 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Brian V. Smith) writes:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> |> David Steuber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> |> > If Windows is so great, why do you have to reboot when you change your
> |> > IP address?
> |> You don't.
> Of course you do! It forces you to and if you don't it doesn't use
> the new address until you do.
Of course you don't. To verify, before I replied, I went from a
hardcoded address to a DHCP-driven one. Then I went back, because the
DHCP servers here are flaky. No reboot, connections were disrupted
for less than a second, and ipconfig verified that the change-over had
indeed occurred.
I believe this is a new feature as of Windows 2000, however.
--
Eric P. McCoy ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
non-combatant, n. A dead Quaker.
- Ambrose Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.development.apps,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Need ideas for university funded project for linux
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 04:30:46 GMT
Nix <$}xinix{[email protected]> writes:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> > [1] Having two separate "enlightenment" and "enlightenment-nosound"
> > packages that differ only in their dependencies is, in my opinion,
> > broken packaging.
> You *do* comprehend the concept of virtual packages, don't you?
If it means that my opinion is wrong, then no, I do not.
> (That is, `this is not a bug. This is a feature.')
I'd drop the sound-based dependencies from E - because if E works
without them, they obviously aren't required - and then suggest the
packages that differ between the two.
--
Eric P. McCoy ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
non-combatant, n. A dead Quaker.
- Ambrose Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Development-System Digest
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