Steve,
This thread started with the question on behaviour.
a)would you send a letter to someone on company paper saying,
You are an idiot?
b)would you stand up at a conference and say,
Person X is an idiot
c)would you spend time at a linux fix up night and
shout at a newbie, you are an idiot
The answer is no no no. My conclusion is that it is never never never
ok to flame newbies. Never.
Yes, we have had obnoxious people on the list. In real life, when you
meet an obnoxious person, you walk away. On the net, we do something
different - we flame them. Thus, my question was a request for someone
to explain.
I have been flamed inappropriately. here are the links:
http://lists.digium.com/pipermail/asterisk-dev/2004-March/003346.html
http://lists.digium.com/pipermail/asterisk-dev/2004-March/003353.html
http://lists.digium.com/pipermail/asterisk-dev/2004-March/003354.html
=====================================================
> 5. I have seen many people who have taken a lot of time out to sort stuff
> out, when there have been communication problems in the way. I haven't
> seen them flamed - things have got a bit grunpy at times, but...
Welcome to the real world. Mechanics (for example) will look a car over,
and advise for the following X things to be fixed. Most times, the
customer takes the advise and gets the job done. Other times, the customer
says, "no - does not need to be done. Yes, I know you have spent time
looking at the car, but the job does not need to be done".
I am sure Nick can tell stories of people who have ignored his legal
advise. I know I have ignored my lawyers advise one or twice. On those
occasions, I was lucky..........
How many times have you told someone that works for you how to fix a job,
and they did not follow your advise ?
===================================================================
> 2. If this person has managed to actually subscribe to the mailing list,
> then they're computer literate to some degree.
Damien Sandras, the writer of GnomeMeeting, has an interesting comment on
this. He has reported of users who have joined the GnomeMeeting mailing
list, but who cannot edit /etc/modules.conf
Conclusion, they are literate to a small small degree.
Derek.
==========================================================
On Mon, 13 Dec 2004, Steve Holdoway wrote:
>
> On Mon, December 13, 2004 9:35 am, Derek Smithies said:
> > Hi,
> > thanks for your comments Chris, I think it explains why with a fair
> > degree of accuracy. You are right - the list behaviour here is pretty
> > good.
> >
> > Now, I would like to explain why I started this thread.
> > Given that such flaming events go on,
> >>You ain't seen nothin' ! If you want some *real* flaming, check out
> >>'alt.os.linux.mandrake' sometime...
> >
> > my suggestion is that newbie's do not join email lists. They (in general)
> > do not know enough so that they can ask the right question. Since they
> > don't know enough (that is why they are called newbies) they get flamed.
> > Newbies are better to find a good book/taught how to use google/find an
> > expert.
> I disagree.
>
> 1. If you're going to ban noobs from the email list, what are you going to
> replace it with? If they can't get anything out of this new box, NOW, then
> most'll give up.
> 2. If this person has managed to actually subscribe to the mailing list,
> then they're computer literate to some degree.
> 3. IMHO, the first step to getting started with linux after M$ is rather
> large, and the use of printer reference material will rarely help
> significantly.
> 4. I haven't seen anyone flamed inappropriately... I reckon the last
> recipient was here either a) to d*ck people about, or b) to promote their
> fringe religion.
> 5. I have seen many people who have taken a lot of time out to sort stuff
> out, when there have been communication problems in the way. I haven't
> seen them flamed - things have got a bit grunpy at times, but...
> >
> > The second reason is that I am hoping that the linux community can clean
> > up its act, and stop flaming. Yes, I know this is a tall ask, but we have
> > to stop acting like children.
> I think that the linux community has a very clean reputation. All
> interests attract their own group of knockers and spoilers, and this
> community more than many has powerful enemies. To some extent, this
> problem has to be addressed.
>
> I know that newsgroups are old had now, but look into the number that have
> been destroyed by the actions of a very few people. Even really
> contentious ones like rec.kites have been attacked!
>
> >
> >
> > Derek.
>
> My $0.02,
>
>
> Steve
>
--
Derek Smithies Ph.D. This PC runs pine on linux for
email
IndraNet Technologies Ltd. If you find a virus apparently
from me, it has
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] forged the e-mail headers on
someone else's machine
ph +64 3 365 6485 Please do not notify me when
(apparently) receiving a
Web: http://www.indranet-technologies.com/ windows virus from me......
