Aren't you all getting a little uptight about this? All the guy wants is someone to help him install Linux, get a few apps running on it, then maybe help him get a few users set up or something. Any self-respecting Linux User Group should be happy to help anyone set up a new box. Not only that, he's willing to pay. Stop trolling the Spartans and let him figure out that he can't run Slackware on his own; if/when he ruins his system, then we can bring Ubuntu back into the mix. In the meantime, anyone who is not interested in helping should maybe stop acting like they're on /b/. The Linux community is already seen as hostile enough to newcomers, this sort of thing would not help that image.
--MarkTraceur On Sun, May 3, 2009 at 10:49 PM, Chris Penn <[email protected]> wrote: > "But here is one gotcha - all this MUST be done under Slackware. > Replacing Slackware with a different distro is NOT permissible. Why? > Because the person paying (me) says so." > > Ha, didnt see that part. Slackware is not hard, possibly more work, but > not hard. > > I would not do the job because of the Second comment. I don't work for > people with that attitude. I have NO problem being friends with some who > has that attitude, but I am not going to work for them unless they pay me > ALOT of money to put up with that attitude. This doesnt sound like a lot of > money to me. > > > I manage 60+ servers and 20 or so desktops, Linux and Unix( LOL and one > Mac mini), and I don't agree with: > > "As for refusing to install consumer distros like Ubuntu and insisting on > Slackware, that is a simple matter of administrative policy. We are not > talking about a home PC for a housewife, ours is a serious organisation > with a chain of command and a clear division of responsibilities, and > the matters of OS selection and overall network planning and management > are taken seriously (that's my area of responsibility)." > > > I am not sure what "administrator policies" you are referring to, I don't > think there is much you can do with slackware "administratively" that others > cant do with debian, ubuntu, RHEL/Centos, Gentoo......its all the same > kernal, regardless of your chain of command. > > " Yes, I am perfectly capable of spending the next few years of my life > learning everything there is to know about F/OSS web/audio/video software > for the functions I'm interested in, but I have far, far more valuable > things to do with my life." > > If you actually understood this part of F(L)OSS, you would understand why > ubuntu was even suggested. If ubuntu is not to your taste or you have alot > of applications that are written with a Debian/Centos/RHEL filesystem in > mind, and you dont feel like configuring them for Ubuntu, then Sure, forget > Ubuntu. Nothing mentioned above falls falls into this category. I have had > this issue and I usually go with Centos. > > You could always setup up a TFTP server and PXE boot them with youf > favorite Slackmix, that might save you some time. Every "serious > organization" should have one of these or some way to distribute OSs and/or > applications. > > "My stance is that the distro matters only to the system administrator, > not to ordinary users, therefore, the choice of distro is the exclusive > privilege of the chief system administrator. Users do not care about > distros, that's an admin matter, a user merely logs in with a company- > issued username and password and is presented with a set of applications > decided upon by the company. Business environment, not home - work, not > play." > > This is true, unless the Admin's choice fails to provide the proper support > that the "users" require to do their job. Im sure you were taking that in > to consideration when you spoke. > > > "I choose Slackware because it's the most UNIX-like of all Linux > distributions (it's for people like me who like UNIX better than Linux > and run Linux only out of necessity)" > > Linux only out of necessity, like ported applications for desktop users. > Again, why ubuntu was suggested. There is often no solution in Unix Unless > you want to either jump through 100 hoops or spend HOURS porting it yourself > and installing the Linux binaries. > > I dont agree, not at all. > > Chris... > > > > > On Mon, May 4, 2009 at 12:09 AM, Michael Sokolov <[email protected] > > wrote: > >> This is in response to the comments by Chris and Roger Rustad - in my >> philosophy there are times when outsourcing certain work is perfectly >> justifiable. There is a reason why division of labor has been invented. >> >> The Interplanetary Internationale is a non-profit organisation with a >> serious mission, and all of our members are hard-working people who do >> their jobs well. Due to being a small non-profit we are already doing >> too much multitasking and wear a lot of hats. I for one wear at least >> 3 major hats (commander, chief engineer and researcher/analyst) and that >> isn't counting the minor ones, so I really don't need to put on yet >> another hat (desktop PC support) if I can avoid it. >> >> Yes, I am perfectly capable of spending the next few years of my life >> learning everything there is to know about F/OSS web/audio/video software >> for the functions I'm interested in, but I have far, far more valuable >> things to do with my life. My philosophy is that if something can be >> outsourced, it should be outsourced, because there are far too many >> things that can't be. Even on the computer/tech side of things there >> are far too many things that only I can do (maintaining 4.3BSD-Quasijarus, >> our main in-house OS, core network admin, certain in-house UNIX >> applications), and the computer/tech stuff in general isn't even the >> primary purpose of our organisation in the first place! Thus when it >> comes to stuff that resides on the lower rungs of my ladder of importance >> (basically all desktop stuff), I certainly want to outsource it. >> >> As for refusing to install consumer distros like Ubuntu and insisting on >> Slackware, that is a simple matter of administrative policy. We are not >> talking about a home PC for a housewife, ours is a serious organisation >> with a chain of command and a clear division of responsibilities, and >> the matters of OS selection and overall network planning and management >> are taken seriously (that's my area of responsibility). >> >> My stance is that the distro matters only to the system administrator, >> not to ordinary users, therefore, the choice of distro is the exclusive >> privilege of the chief system administrator. Users do not care about >> distros, that's an admin matter, a user merely logs in with a company- >> issued username and password and is presented with a set of applications >> decided upon by the company. Business environment, not home - work, not >> play. >> >> In the good old days of UNIX there was a clear division between the OS >> and applications, and that's how I like to keep it. An operating system >> should only come with system software like daemons and a minimal set of >> basic tools (shell, awk, C compiler, that kind of stuff); everything >> else is none of the OS distribution's business. High-level applications >> like web/audio/video SW absolutely do not belong in an OS distribution >> in my opinion. >> >> I choose Slackware because it's the most UNIX-like of all Linux >> distributions (it's for people like me who like UNIX better than Linux >> and run Linux only out of necessity) and also because it maintains a >> clear distinction between users and administrators which is essential to >> my business model. When I say that users and administrators should be >> separate, I don't just mean separate accounts/passwords, I mean different >> people in flesh and blood. That's why I don't believe in the sudo bs - >> if a certain function should be available to ordinary users whose jobs >> aren't in IT, there should be a setuid program which they can use like >> a normal command with no fuss, whereas if a certain function should not >> be available to such users, it should not be available period - if you >> need the services of the IT department, pick up the phone and call the >> IT helpdesk. >> >> Our organisation is seeking an IT support person who would serve as a >> go-between intermediary between the core OS/network engineering (me) on >> one side and the non-technical user community on the other, someone who >> can effectively bridge the two worlds. >> >> MS >> >> P.S. In response to Roger Rustad's comment about nudity, that is >> absolutely not permitted here and is not practiced by me or by anyone >> else who lives or works at any of our facilities. We generally follow >> the standards of conduct which were set in the Soviet Union for >> Communist Party members and for military officers. >> _______________________________________________ >> LinuxUsers mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://socallinux.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linuxusers >> > > > > -- > "As we open our newspapers or watch our television screens, we seem to be > continually assaulted by the fruits of Mankind's stupidity." > -Roger Penrose > > _______________________________________________ > LinuxUsers mailing list > [email protected] > http://socallinux.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linuxusers > >
