On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:24 PM, Nick Williams < [email protected]> wrote:
> Ahhh. Okay, I see where the disconnect was, now. > > I think our best bet is a "boolean password() default false;" attribute on > the @PluginAttribute annotation. This idea was mentioned earlier by someone > else (I've lost track of who). The configuration processor should then log > ten asterisks (**********) in place of the value for that attribute if it's > given a value, or null/blank as it usually would if it's not given a value. > > I think this is going to be more effective than using char[] instead of > String, IMO. > > Thoughts? > If we are going to do that, we might as well create a Password class that wraps a char[] (or a UTF-8 byte[]) and toString()s itself as "**********". Then you call a getValue() on the Password when it is time to use it. Gary > > On Aug 22, 2013, at 12:26 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: > > A password that is in the xml configuration will be logged to the status > logger. It formats the arguments to the methods. You would need to > annotate the attribute with something to get it to mask the value. > > Ralph > > On Aug 22, 2013, at 9:58 AM, Nick Williams wrote: > > I think a more accurate statement is "regardless of how passwords are > stored (char[], String, etc.), it's a Log4j design issue to ensure that > they are never logged under any circumstances." I think it's more important > to be cognizant of what you're doing with passwords and make sure they > aren't exposed, no matter how they're represented. > > Nick > > On Aug 22, 2013, at 11:49 AM, Gary Gregory wrote: > > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 12:17 PM, Nick Williams < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> I believe it's sufficient to simply *make sure* our code doesn't let >> these passwords from the configuration get into logs. I don't see it as >> necessary to add special password support, IMO. But I could be missing >> something. >> > > It's something that is easy enough to do (String <-> char[]) so I want to > make sure that if we leave it as is, we're all OK saying "passwords are in > plain Strings and it's not a Log4j design issue" > > Gary > > >> N >> >> On Aug 22, 2013, at 6:28 AM, Gary Gregory wrote: >> >> On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Nick Williams < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> This discussion comes up on the Tomcat mailing list at least every few >>> months, and it always ends the same way. >>> >>> The passwords are in a configuration file. That configuration file lives >>> with the application. So, for example, if the application is a web app the >>> configuration file lives on the web app server or a server it has access >>> to. Either way, if a hacker gets a hold of that configuration file, it's >>> because they've breached your firewall/server protection systems and it's >>> game over anyway. >>> >>> There's really no use in making efforts to protect passwords in these >>> configuration files. Any effort to do so just adds a _false_ sense of >>> security, which is more dangerous than no security at all. >>> >> >> My concern is more in the other direction. When secrets are in String >> objects, they end up as plain text in log files or any kind of dump (if >> Strings are dumped with toString()). At work, we get different kinds of >> logs from users where the user has painstakingly blanked out certain data. >> Using char[] avoids saying giving in plain text your secrets when they are >> in Strings. In the case of Log4j2, this may never happen as the code stands >> now (do we have passwords in toString()s?)... >> >> Gary >> >> >>> Nick >>> >>> On Aug 19, 2013, at 9:54 AM, Gary Gregory wrote: >>> >>> On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:52 AM, Gary Gregory >>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>> >>>> On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:34 AM, Ralph Goers <[email protected]>wrote: >>>> >>>>> I'm not sure how this applies to what you are suggesting, but we >>>>> should avoid passwords being in clear text in the configuration. I would >>>>> suggest using a standard plugin interface similar to what I did with the >>>>> secret key provider in the Flume Appender. >>>>> >>>> >>>> We should at the last offer something like >>>> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Jetty/Howto/Secure_Passwords >>>> >>> >>> So perhaps we need a boolean password attribute on PluginElement and >>> PluginAttribute >>> >>> Gary >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Gary >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Ralph >>>>> >>>>> On Aug 19, 2013, at 7:29 AM, Gary Gregory <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Paul Benedict >>>>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Do you need the password ever after authentication? >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I guess it depends on whether the code handles re-auth in case of a >>>>> disconnect. >>>>> >>>>> Gary >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 8:55 AM, Gary Gregory <[email protected] >>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 7:27 AM, Ralph Goers <[email protected]>wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What passwords? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> For example: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.core.net.SMTPManager.FactoryData.password >>>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.core.net.JMSTopicManager.password >>>>>>> - >>>>>>> org.apache.logging.log4j.core.net.JMSQueueManager.FactoryData.password >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Gary >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Ralph >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Aug 19, 2013, at 4:22 AM, Gary Gregory <[email protected]> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I've seen it done many places: Should we track passwords internally >>>>>>>> as char[] instead of String for ivars. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This prevents Log4j spilling your secrets by accident in a toString >>>>>>>> to internal log call. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Gary >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] >>>>>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second >>>>>>>> Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>>>>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>>>>>>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>>>>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>>>>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>>>>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] >>>>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second >>>>>>> Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>>>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>>>>>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>>>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>>>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>>>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>> Paul >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] >>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second >>>>> Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>>>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] >>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second >>>> Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] >>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second >>> Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] >> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second >> Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >> >> >> > > > -- > E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] > Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second > Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> > JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> > Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> > Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com > Home: http://garygregory.com/ > Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory > > > > > -- E-Mail: [email protected] | [email protected] Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com Home: http://garygregory.com/ Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory
