On Friday 14 January 2005 18:45, you wrote: Not mentioned among the other replies are the works by Pietro Paolo Melii. Which is contrary to the others in his ornament indications, but explains what he means. He writes the following in 'il quinto libro' ' ... dove trovarai un T come questo antecedente, farai il tremolo, nella notta dove sera sotto' which means something like 'where you find/see a T like this make a tremolo on the note below. Another indication is 'dove trovarai un diesis come questo XX (he indicates something which looks like a 'w'), ponterai col dito nella nota dove sera sotto facendo sostenare la voce alla cora a pocho a pocho' which I interprete as making a mordent with the note below the main note
And the last one is 'dove troverari due note legate insieme come queste (4 -5) baterai la prima, scorendo con l'istesso dito sula seconda qual'e la perfetta. which means "where you find the ligature above strike the first and glide with the same finger to the second which is the 'main' note. ". This means an appogiature from below. Taco Walstra > I didn't get any bites on this email I sent last week. I wonder if it > made it to the list. One more try. Maybe someone has some thoughts on > ornamentation? > TIA > > In anticipation of the immanent arrival of my archlute I've been > looking at some Gianoncelli. I have some questions about the > ornaments. The only writing to be found is one page at the beginning > which appears to be a dedication in Italian and the date of 1650. Am > I missing a page where he explains about ornaments? > > Is there any evidence that a trill could start on the main note OR > upper auxiliary within the same piece around this period? Sometimes > one or the other seem more appropriate. Sometimes appoggiaturas seem > right. There are two ornament signs that I can see: a T with dots on > either side of it and double crosses. I'm guessing the double cross > is for vibrato, although in some pieces a hold indication would make > just as much sense, if not more. The Ts occur all over: on the beat, > off the beat, on chordal tones, on other tones, and in cadential > formulas. Often they appear on weak beats in places I wouldn't expect. > > In Paul Odette's Antique dances CD, I'm pretty sure he plays the > Bergamasca by Gianoncelli with the Ts all played as upper mordants. > I'd double check that but I can't find the CD at the moment. I would > certainly defer to his musicology, but there may be room here for > other interpretations in the other movements of the same suite (if it > can be called that). For example, in one of the corente there are > cadential figures that approach the T note from an upper note > preceded by a hemiola, which just begs for starting a trill on the > upper auxiliary. > > T > ------------------------|----------|--------------- > -X-----8--7--5----------|----------|--------------- > -X--8--8-----7------5-7-|8---------|-8------------- > ------------------------|---0------|-0------------- > ------------------------|----------|-0------------- > ------------------------|----------|--------------- > 12 11 X 14 > > number of dashes indicate relative rhythm. View with non proportional > font please. > > (Strange, I just realize I unconsciously flipped the Italian tab. > Never mind, you get the idea.) > > BTW, in this piece the figure of a dotted quarter note followed by > two 16ths happens three times with only one of those having the dot > written; a dotted quarter note followed by an 8th happens twice with > no dot either time. It is almost a convention. It made me recall a > conversation I had with Steve Player about the famous Canarios by > Sanz. He and Andrew Lawrence King maintain that all those missing > dots are correct and it should be played with changing odd time > signatures. I don't think so here, though. > cheers, To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
