2012/3/22 Thierry Vignaud <[email protected]>: > On 22 March 2012 09:31, You-Cheng Hsieh <[email protected]> wrote: >>> note that having a couple x11 package is not installing x11. >>> I've made the minimal install quite a lot smaller. >>> >>> We still have issues with suggests that makes installation explodes. >>> I've reports some bugs but maintainers just don't care. >>> See eg: https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4357 that got >>> reaffected to me because the maintainer doesn't care about >>> bloating the install >>> This particular one isn't about minimal install but about gnome install >>> but the underlying issue will bloats any minimal install + light desktop >>> + _one_ gtk+ application. >>> >> Both gnome-keyring and task-gnome are maintained by nobody, could you >> modify the spec and close the bug? > > I've made quite some changes for mga2 in order to bring minimal > install under control. > But that can't work in the long term. > I'ven't enough time & I cannot do it alone. > I did it twice back @mdv and yet people keep introduced new interesting > ways to bloat again. > > I don't want to imply Olav did it. But he's packager of one of the offending > packages, and so inherited part of mdv heritage. > So I wrote a bug about it in order to pull maintainers in. > > Every packager should be made aware of Implications of: > - suggests > - library requiring the tools they were created for > > It's easy to add a suggest ("hey it'll just make the user experience better"), > but eventually the suggested package can start a cycles that will pull > quite a lot more packages. > > See https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4357#c5 > systemd was initially pulling: > - the whole gtk+ stack, > - openldap, > - avahi, > - gamin, > - fuse, > - colord, > - gnome-keyring, > - seahorse, > - dirmngr > - python > > And none of it (but python) has actually to do with systemd. > It was just that required library actually suggest or requires another one > which also suggested or required ... > > Everyone should be concerned about that. > > I've broke some requires/suggest cycles, but I cannot do it alone, > everyone should contribute (and also should try not to introduce > new ones) > > I think that some of those "comfort" suggests should be moved > from some low level library or tool package to task-<desktop> > packages. > > Thus no I won't fix every issue. > People have to test install and have to get interested in reducing > size of install. > This is not a personal attack against Olav that does a good job. > That means for everyone to get in the implications of requires & > suggests. > Not looking only at that particular package but at the global view, > the installed system. > > Not all suggests will bloat installing from DVD as some won't make > it into the DVD image. But some will b/c they're required by other > packages and thus will succeed in being suggested. > > Minimal install won't be as perfect as installing basesystem with urpmi > because of installer also pulling packages needed for HW (eg: LVM, > SMP, bluetooth, ...) > > At least for mga2, it's has been reduced. > But it could be more. > > Also installing a desktop (GNOME & KDE) is huge these days. > Something should be made about it. > Maybe splitting task-{gnome,kde}-networking and the like and moving > them under CAT_NETWORK, CAT_OFFICE, CAT_GAMES, CAT_INTERNET, > CAT_MULTIMEDIA and the like in rpmsrate. > > But this is the job of everyone. > Not just me. > > My 2 cents
Thanks for your proposal. But anyway this is for Mageia 3. Could we please calm down and focus again on coming release? We do have work enough for everybody :) Cheers -- Anne http://www.mageia.org
