Having spent enough time wrangling Mesa/MacOS on Arm Macs.... the correct solution is to migrate to Linux. everything else is pain.
On Wed, May 04, 2022 at 12:38:55AM +0000, Jose Fonseca wrote: > I'm not sure exactly what Homebrew provides, and I'm not able to > investigate it now. > Yes, using Mesa software rendering to fill the void left by Opengl > deprecation makes some sense. But note is still software rendering, not > GPU accelerated. And one needs to consider the x86 -> arm. > You could consider somehow integrating jogl with osmesa -- offscreen > rendering -Mesa -- which builds and runs pretty much anywhere Mesa builds > -- thereby bypassing the headaches of integrating with mac specifics > technologies such as CGL and Cocoa > There are also other alternatives with considering, such > as https://moltengl.com/moltengl/ > Jose > Get Outlook for Android > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > From: Martin Pernollet <martin.pernol...@protonmail.com> > Sent: Monday, May 2, 2022 1:31:43 AM > To: Jose Fonseca <jfons...@vmware.com> > Cc: mesa-dev@lists.freedesktop.org <mesa-dev@lists.freedesktop.org> > Subject: Re: Enable OpenGL software rendering on macOS > > > ** External Email > > Hi Jose, > Many thanks for your answer. > JOGL classes enabling GL binding macOS all refer to CGL, so yes, I think I > want to rely on CGL (there is however in JOGL a couple of classes allowing > to work with X11, but they're used on Linux only). > I can't access the Apple M1 on which I built Mesa right now, but homebrew > on another macOS provides libGL and not libGLX. > > ls /usr/local/Cellar/mesa/21.1.2/lib > > dri libGL.dylib libGLESv1_CM.dylib libGLESv2.dylib libglapi.dylib > > libGL.1.dylib libGLESv1_CM.1.dylib libGLESv2.2.dylib libglapi.0.dylib > pkgconfig > > > One motivation for enabling Mesa on macOS is actually the deprecated > status of OpenGL. I would expect this software implementation of GL to > simply provide an image to be copied to a native window/frame, without > having to rely on CGL. Hence, one could continue working with simple > OpenGL even if macOS doesn't provide such API. > Does it sound reasonable? > Martin > Envoye avec la messagerie securisee ProtonMail. > ------- Original Message ------- > Le vendredi 29 avril 2022 a 16:08, Jose Fonseca <jfons...@vmware.com> a > ecrit : > > The difficulty with OpenGL on macOS is that all driver interfaces are > both undocumented and deprecated. > If you want to override the system OpenGL, you can use apitrace code as > reference. There are two approaches: > 1. DYLD_FRAMEWORK_PATH > https://github.com/apitrace/apitrace/blob/master/cli/cli_trace.cpp > 2. DYLD_INSERT_LIBRARIES > https://github.com/apitrace/apitrace/tree/dyld-interpose (experimental > branch) > > AFAIK, Mesa build for macOS generates a ibGLX which depends on X11, > which is probably not what you want. You want to use Mesa for macOS > apps which use CGL as opposed to GLX, right? > So, if one wants to have a SW renderer on macOS with llvmpipe without > depending on X11, then one would need to implement: > * a new Gallium frontend that implements CGL API (equivalent to the > WGL frontend that exists for Windows) > * a new SW renderer winsys that draws pixels to Cocoa window somehow > (equivalent to the GDI winsys that draws to a Windows GDI surface) > It's not a matter of just integrating existing components together -- > there's lot of new code that would be need here -- I'd reckon 2 months > for somebody familiar with Mesa/macOS, 6 - 12 months for somebody more > novice. And let's be frank, given mac deprecation of OpenGL and > migration away from Intel to Arm, the usefulness of this in the long > term is dubious. > Jose > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > From: mesa-dev <mesa-dev-boun...@lists.freedesktop.org> on behalf of > Martin Pernollet <martin.pernol...@protonmail.com> > Sent: Friday, April 29, 2022 12:32 > To: mesa-dev@lists.freedesktop.org <mesa-dev@lists.freedesktop.org> > Subject: Enable OpenGL software rendering on macOS > > > ** External Email > > TLDR : I failed using Mesa software rendering on macOS. I am looking for > advice to invoke mesa's libGL.dylib without relying on macOS's system > GL. > Hi everyone, > I am building (java) software involving Mesa for CPU rendering. I use > CPU rendering as fallback when JOGL (OpenGL binding for Java) fail to > use the GPU natively. This is sometime the case for old Linux > distributions, this will certainly be frequent on macOS in the future > due to Apple's OpenGL deprecation. > Mesa CPU rendering is working great on Ubuntu (by enabling > LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=true) and Windows (by simply loading Mesa's DLL > instead of system DLL, no need to ask for software mode). > I however thrive to use Mesa's software rendering on macOS for the > following reasons > * Spying dynamic library load sequence shows that whenever Mesa's > libGL.dylib is loaded, Apple Metal and libGL.dylib are loaded > before, even when using DYLD tricks to ensure Mesa get loaded before > any other library (except the Java VM) [1] Someone says that Mesa's > macOS implementation relies on system GL [4]. I noticed that when > enabling LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=true, this activates Apple software > rendering but not Mesa's software rendering [5]. I wonder how I > could avoid this and use a pure Mesa's OpenGL implementation in this > situation. > * When getting out of the java World > * Running a pre-built glxgear/glxinfo installed through MacPorts > only allows using Apple's libGL.dylib but not Mesa's > libGL.dylib [2]. > * Building glxinfo myself by linking explicitely to Mesa's GL + > X11 lead to an X11 error that I am not able to depict [3]. > This has been discussed already on Khronos community [1] but I have no > clue how to go further. I hope some experts here can help me solve this! > Thanks in advance, > Martin > [1] > https://community.khronos.org/t/failing-to-load-mesa3d-on-macos-instead-of-macos-provided-opengl-library/108408 > [2] > https://community.khronos.org/t/failing-to-load-mesa3d-on-macos-instead-of-macos-provided-opengl-library/108408/14 > [3] > https://community.khronos.org/t/failing-to-load-mesa3d-on-macos-instead-of-macos-provided-opengl-library/108408/19 > [4] > https://community.khronos.org/t/how-to-use-opengl-on-zink-mesa-moltenvk-and-macos/108160/18 > [5] > https://community.khronos.org/t/failing-to-load-mesa3d-on-macos-instead-of-macos-provided-opengl-library/108408/17 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ** External Email: This email originated from outside of the > organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you > recognize the sender.
