On Fri, Dec 21, 2018 at 11:37 AM Lionel Landwerlin <lionel.g.landwer...@intel.com> wrote: > > On 19/12/2018 17:19, Kenneth Graunke wrote: > > On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 8:10:49 AM PST Eric Engestrom wrote: > >> The point of this patch is for people to not be able to ignore this, and > >> have to become aware of the existence of Meson and our intention to > >> remove autotools, whenever this may happen. > >> > >> Some people have already noticed, probably because they keep up with > >> mesa-dev@, but the point is that some people haven't. > >> > >> Without this patch: > >> - people will continue being unaware, until > >> - autotools gets removed, and these people are going to try their > >> use-cases, and probably find issues > >> - issues will get fixed, hopefully quickly, but blocking them completely > >> in the mean time > >> > >> With this patch: > >> - people will *have to notice* that something's changing > >> - they'll choose to either ignore it, use the flag, and *choose* to go > >> with the option above > >> - or they can choose to try meson, get any issues fixed *while still > >> being able to work with their old setup in the mean time* > >> > >> This last bit is the entire point of this patch, so let me repeat it: > >> people will report meson issues while there's still time to use their > >> old autotools setup. > >> > >> I'm definitely in favour: > >> Acked-by: Eric Engestrom <eric.engest...@intel.com> > > Eric's reasoning here makes sense. In case there is anyone out there > > who has been putting off trying Meson, this will properly exhort them > > to try it, and identify any problems, yet still let them continue using > > their old system for a little while longer. > > > > Acked-by: Kenneth Graunke <kenn...@whitecape.org> > > > > I've been using Meson for a long time, and it is dramatically better to > > work with - both to write, and to use. It is a little bit different, > > and that took some getting used to. But it was absolutely worth it. > > > > We need a way to make progress here. Matt's concern is very valid - > > people can simply keep moving the goal posts. And that's incredibly > > frustrating for the people doing the work. > > > > Given that we've had the Meson build system for over a year, I think > > time is up. Marek once received review feedback to a patch a year after > > he wrote it, and he responded with something like "I've moved on, feel > > free to write a patch." I think that applies here. The Meson build has > > had many contributors at this point. If it's not good enough, feel free > > to help fix it. It's worth noting that it is good enough for the major > > distros, which have switched, and a large portion of the community uses > > it exclusively. Dylan has done a ton of work to upstream Meson to > > address our needs and improve the usability of the project. The rest > > of the Meson developers have been very responsible as well. We have > > every reason to believe it will keep getting better. > > > > We can't keep kicking the autotools can down the road indefinitely. > > We need a forcing function like this patch, then eventual removal. > > Expecting new contributors to write 4 build systems is just...bad. > > I'm hopeful that we can get down to two (Meson and Android) soon. > > > > For what it's worth, I'm hoping to merge Iris soon, and it does not have > > an autotools build system, nor do I intend to write one. At that point, > > you won't be able to build the new Intel OpenGL drivers with autotools. > > > > --Ken > > I very much agree with Ken here. > Autotools has been a pain to deal with especially since we had to > maintain 2 build systems. > We already have part of our tools that do not get built with Autotools. > I think the main reason being that debugging Meson builds is a lot > faster that Autotools ones. > So I would be happy if we could send a signal that this will go soon and > strongly recommend users to tell us what isn't working. > > Just finally adding that pretty big projects like systemd (only uses > Meson), GLib (both Meson/Autotools, but Meson default) and a bunch of > other Gnome stuff is now being built with Meson in major distros (just > checked Debian which also builds Mesa using Meson), so it seems to me at > least a significant part of the community won't be very surprised. > And this patch is the call for people who haven't noticed yet. > > Acked-by: Lionel Landwerlin <lionel.g.landwer...@intel.com> >
I also agree that maintaining 2 build systems (well, actually 3 because android) is major pita, and meson is much nicer to deal with than autotools. I think the approach that this patch is taking, to a little more actively push people who haven't tried meson to give it a try and speak up if something is missing, is extremely reasonable and far more conservative than what a lot of other projects have done. Acked-by: Rob Clark <robdcl...@gmail.com> > - > Lionel > _______________________________________________ > mesa-dev mailing list > mesa-dev@lists.freedesktop.org > https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/mesa-dev _______________________________________________ mesa-dev mailing list mesa-dev@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/mesa-dev
