Hi Tim,
OK, I guess the first thing I assumed (and possibly
Mike did, too) was since
you called it a fall it was like Gao-Guenie: a
witnessed fall.
But since you are apparently discussing an
unwitnessed fall from a hot
desert a.k.a. for us, dense collecting area (don't
know where else to get
all those Mars rocks), the best thing to do is to
plot the strewn field. In
the contemporary world that seems so difficult since
we can't even get
location information for one stone that has already
been through maybe
several hands.
So I only see two options or combinations between
them:
1) Don't buy anything that is not documented.
Discourage others supporting
this.
2) Buy everything under an agreement of trust from a
reputable seller and
submit the batch to a scientist and let him/her
minimize the guesswork and
possibly minor tests if doubts come up. Or in a
positive light, to convince
the scientist to say the batch is the same material
or cull out what is not
to arrive at the TKW.
If you want to by Mars without any formal
classification, in the form of
many pebbles, there is no solution except 2),
whether you go it alone or
spread the risk with partners. Because you would
now be representing a rock
that has been subjectively field "classified".
While some people can live
with this, others can't. If you can at least get
locational information for
your specimens, you don't have to give the full
20/20 - or anything for that
matter if enough to meet the combined 20/20 is in
curation as vouchers for
the group after the naming of your material - if a
scientist agrees to
classify and pair it to an existing classification.
This is the motivation
of the newer guidelines.
Some people get mad about subjective classification,
because they broke the
ground on the sample and "invested", while others
are pissed that it is
obvious and common sense dictates the material is
what it is (arguments
like, bought from the same trader, got from the same
nomad, found together):
with no further support except subjective judgements
perceived as strong and
well founded.
This latter may be true, but that still doesn't
remove the reality. Only if
the specimens fit together can this be foolproof.
Even an expert meteorite
hunter scientist can find or purchase a handful of
meteorites in the field
from a known fall and every once in a while a
terrestrial rock can sneak in
that has you fooled like a baby. Let me say it has
happened to me, and it
is a very frustrating and humbling experience. Some
time I'll tell the
story of a meteorwrong that saw me coming it was a
remarkable fraud that
would surprise anyone - the best scientists, at
their first glance,
included.
So, the reality is also that unless each rock is
carefully studied, nothing
can avoid ocassional duds getting mixed in. Not to
mention incorrect
pairing of similr meteorites. Luckily in the sandy
desert this isn't as
great a problem as areas with varieties of rocks.
How Unsettling, How Disagreeable to the innocent
collector and enthusiast,
scientist alike- but true. This is rthe dirty
laundry of meteorite
collecting. Hopefully someone has a better
suggestion, but I wouldn't hold
my breath unless I were an alchemist capable of
ethically transmuting
batches of meteorites ;-) There is no free lunch...
and no one can make
promises for something that hasn't been done. (Or
can they?)
This whole thing gets sticky, when, you buy
meteorites from the literally
same batch that another person has already
classified. Sure: you may have
the same material, but then again, just because the
original buyer may not
have demanded 100% error proffing during the
classification and is selling
some stones under the classification he got, doesn't
make yours any more
paired to the ones that were used for the typing
work.
Best wishes, Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: "Timothy Heitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "mexicodoug" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 12:47 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Samples
> Doug,
>
> This is what I'm thinking.
>
> Lets say I bought 50 Mars stones and the biggest
was only 8 grams, now
> what?
>
> I'm thinking what do I do now Doug?
>
>
> Mike Farmer brings up a good point tens of
thousands of Gao stones, and
> why
> dont cut them or classify all of them! Same with
Canyon Diablo.
>
>
> Tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "mexicodoug" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 12:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Samples
>
>
> Tim,
> I give up, what are you thinking - to sell them
unclassified except for a
> 2
> gram stone and then give a scientist 0.4 grams in
exchange for classifying
> the entire fall? Naughty naughty
> Doug
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Timothy Heitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Timothy Heitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
"Andreas Gren"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'Peter A Shugar'"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 12:09 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Samples
>
>
> What if you had 20 stones all around 2 to10 grams
each all from the same
> fall?
>
> Tim
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Timothy Heitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Andreas Gren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
"'Peter A Shugar'"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 11:55 AM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Samples
>
>
>
