Hi Mike, > Does anyone keep or maintain a list of the largest lunar or martian >meteorites?
Sure. And not only of the largest. Of all. Here you have the always up-to-date-lists of all lunars and Martians, maintained by Norbert Classen. They're comfortable, cause they group the pairings together, so it's easy to see which ones of that number salad, belong together and stem from the same original fall. Lunars: http://www.meteoris.de/luna/list.html So according that list, the ranking of the largest specimens would be: 1.Kalahari 009 13.5 kg 2.NWA 5000 11.562kg (Shisr 162 5.525kg there we have no information yet, whether it was 1 stone) 3.NWA 3163 1.634kg 4.DaG 400 1.425kg (NWA 4734 1.372kg if we presume, that it was one mass, which was hammered into pieces, on the other hand the Bulletin speaks of 2 stones found.) 5.LAP 02205 1.226kg 6. NWA 482 1.015kg ?7. NWA 2996 0.968kg will be published in this year's Bulletin, no idea whether it is one stone or several. 8. DaG 1042 0.801kg 9. Dho 025 0.751kg 10. MAC 88105 0.663kg The ranking by the total amount of material found from a fall: 1. Kalahari 14.98kg 2. NWA 5000 11.528kg 3. Shisr 162 (160,161) 5.525kg (5,683kg if they belong together) 4. NWA 3163-4881 2.448kg 5. NWA 2995-5152 1.944kg 6. LAP 02205-04841 1.930kg 7. DaG 400 1.425kg 8. NWA 4734 1.372kg 9. DaG 262-1048 1.328kg 10.NWA 773-Anoual 1.222kg Note again, how important the contribution was, from private side, which shall be now restricted by the will of a few scientists. The Antarctic campaigns were brought into being with the justification to recover planetary material. And they were successful. Found in 32 years 19 different lunars, together a little less than 5kgs. The private initiatives found in 10 years 40 diffent lunars (+ earlier in 97 Dag 262 + old Calacalong) - together 50kgs. You see therefore, what for a large asinity they plan to commit. All other official expeditions of the recent 30 years found a single piece of a lunar, the 0.2kg of SaU 169 in Oman. Now Oman has forbidden all private hunting, cause of a few yellers. But the private hunters found there 18 lunars in more than hundred individual stones & fragments at a weight of 10kgs. So in fact nobody can understand, what they are doing and for what it could be good? For science obviously not. The outcome all observed with Libya, where the find rates completely broke down with a factor of 200 and in Australia too. The only arguments they produce and itinerate are: The lunars would disappear on a "black market" and would be lost for research. That argument is disproven. All lunars are brought to classification (samples as deposit even delivered for free). The holders of the main masses are very well known, often even given in the Bulletins. And the material is offered perfectly transparently and accessible by everyone via internet. Bulletins they should know as their basic tool in their field, if they have troubles to use internet, they can put a student for some afternoons in front of the computer, to gather the offers for them. So there is no black market. A black market rather would be initiated at all by the restrictive regulations they try to enforce. But more likely it will be, that noone will go searching for meteorites anymore. Like in Libya, like in Australia. And the people in Sahara, they will do without meteorites and will make their fossils and minerals, like always, cause meteorites always were a really more than marginal business for them. Well and to find them by their own... the stats for the last decades aren't encouraging - and to replace the manpower and experience of the hundreds of nameless hunters - that would be an immensely expensive task. Second argument or stereotype they put forth is, that meteorites from the private sector would be to expensive for research and that the prices would have soared by the private activities. The latter is extremely easy to disprove. The desert meteorites yield the cheapest prices in history and they are cheap like never before and the rarest and most interesting types are available at rates so low, like never in history before. Let's stay with the lunars, 1st was Calcalong - reported were carat-prices leading to a gram price >1 million, and the very first two years the DaGs had prices at 200k$/g. Now we have prices for the lunars of 400$ up to 2000$ a gram, depending on the rareness of the subtype and on the size of the cuts. Most expensive are the historic falls and finds, they are expensive because of the low availability. Why the availability is low? Rrrright, because the by far largest amount of them is sitting in museums and institutes. So that material they do already have and they are doing their research on these stone for 200 years now. And expensive are those meteorites from countries which have restrictive laws. You saw Gibeon quadrupling since the export prohibition came into force and you saw Tagish Lake selling 5times more expensive than necessary, cause the Canadians failed to recover the material in a timely manner and because only a small amount was allowed to be exported. So any curator and any institute has now to pay by far more for that stuff or has to give more exchange material if they swap, than necessary. So the price can't it be. All official expeditions 1 lunar, 200grams. Antarctica 5kgs - and the Antarctic campaigns had cost so far several billions. 50kgs by privateers, prices 0.4 - 2 million per kg. If they want to fly to Moon or Mars and it is cheap, they pay a few hundred millions to Lockhead, EADS et.al for 1 mission. I'm not good in maths, but I fear they are worse. Can anyone see any logic in their behaviour? Can anyone tell me, what the advances and advantages for research of their agenda could be? Well, of course not they pay: you pay, I pay (o.k. me not that much. EUROMET is dead, cause Antarctica was to expensive for them. On the other hand ESA was hunting terrestrial basalts to learn about Martian geology... To research on original Martian rocks would have been much cheaper or to take them additionally woudn't have been a big deal.) It's our tax-money. I for my own would wish a more reasonable and effective use of that money and think it is a grave lapse, that there so few resort to the meanwhile most important source of today's meteoritics and Earth-bound planetology: The desert finds. And I'm missing an outcry of the meteorite scientists. On what will you work, if they will be successful and there won't be any meteorites from the hot deserts (else than a few of the usual finds of W3 H5 and L6?)anymore? What shall your colleagues at those institutes will do, which are not connected to the Antarctic programs? How will you be able to pay then the few meteorites still freely available, if the prices will multiply due to the shortage in the aftermaths of restrictive laws, if you are even now - in times of the historic all-time low of meteorite prices - not able to acquire that material you desire? I don't know. I know only, that the world can live without meteorites. But I can't understand the fervour and the waggery to bring us so far. Back to topic: The best list and the best survey of all lunaites with all details and tons of photos offers Randy Korotev's site: http://www.meteorites.wustl.edu/lunar/moon_meteorites.htm There you'll have also a photo of the Kalahari 008-mass: http://meteorites.wustl.edu/lunar/stones/kalahari008.htm For Martians such a fantastic site doesn't exist, but Norbert's pages offer a huge reservoir of information and pics: http://www.meteoris.de/ As well as the complete list of Martians: http://www.meteoris.de/mars/list.html Else there would be the NASA Lunar Meteorite Compendium by Kevin Righter: http://www-curator.jsc.nasa.gov/antmet/lmc/index.cfm The NASA Mars meteorite site unfortunately lies idle for many years now. http://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/snc/ Maybe NASA isn't that interested in the geology and history of planet Mars or seen the budget restrictions it would be to expensive to let an apprentice update the page... Best! Martin ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteoritefirstname.lastname@example.org http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list