Hello,
You are referring to the statement I made, and I reread it and I see
that I was not clear.
Many years ago, there was not an AD Ban or a 1 Ad a week rule, this
was before your time on the list. In those days, a huge amount of ads
coincided with a multitude of diverse meteorite topics. It is in my
opinion that in the days of many ads, we had better and more serious
topics on meteorites than we do today. The topics today are fine, but
in the old days they were richer in content. My opinion. The many ads
and many better topics have nothing to do with each other THAN they
coincided with each other on this list with NO PROBLEM. Until, a small
percentage of people whined and complained, until the complaining
became THE PROBLEM -NOT THE ADS.
Yes Art owns the list, Yes, we owe a great debt of gratitude to Art
and many thanks. However, when the day comes that people make someone
else the GOD and RULER, not to be challenged or questioned, than that
of course is the day when decay begins. All I have asked is for a vote
on the issue which concerns 900+ people. I have always thought this
was a good idea-since an immense amount of complaining centers around
the issue. I will be leaving the list shortly, but the issue will not
be resolved by my leaving because your root problem will still be with
you. At least my ads will be gone and that should make some of you
very happy.
Think about it - if there is not a challenge of open discussion (like
voting on a topic) than what you have is a no growth situation that
leads to decay. My opinion.
Yes Art owns the list, Yes, we owe a great debt of gratitude to Art
and many thanks. However, to make Art's word or anyones word the
final say on a subject. Is insane. History shows that to be true.
No worries though, everything is good too.
Best Wishes
Michael Cottingham
On Oct 16, 2009, at 9:07 AM, Galactic Stone & Ironworks wrote:
Hi List,
"THE BEST TOPICS. THE BEST CONVERSTION ON METEORITES COINCIDED WITH
THE MOST ADS."
I respectfully disagree here. I've seen perfectly good questions
about meteoritics posted in the past, only to hear crickets and see
tumbleweeds in response. More often than not, the preponderance of
ads on the list is distracting at best. I adhere to the rule and I
expect others to, regardless of how they justify themselves. A $50
sale for me can make the difference between buying groceries or paying
a bill, yet I post no more than one ad a week.(admittedly, once or
twice in two+ years I have broken this rule) It's incredulous to
think that someone with a million dollar collection needs sales so bad
that the rules must broken, again and again. I could probably use the
sales more than 99% of the rule breakers. When was the last time the
big dealers rolled coins to buy gas or groceries?
All of this is moot anyway - the only opinion on this issue that
matters is Art's. Until he chimes in, all of this discord is
pointless.
Like someone else said before - contact Art in private and discuss
this with him. There are 1000+ people here to learn about meteorites
- I would wager that most of them don't care to hear all of this
belly-aching over advertisements.
Back to my original point - many of the best discussions on this list
(in my ~2 years here) have not centered around ads. I can cite
examples from the archives, but again - I'm not Art, so who cares?
A piece of friendly advice for the anti-ad crowd - use your inbox
filters!
I haven't seen an ad from any of the rule breakers in months - they go
straight to my junk bin.
Best regards and clear skies,
MikeG
PS - AD! - I have Udei Station, Gibeon and Seymchan etched slices
available for sale! Contact me offlist for details. These are not on
my website and come from my collection cabinet. :)
On 10/15/09, michael cottingham <[email protected]> wrote:
Hello,
DITTO. Also the days when we had the MOST ads, were the most
productive on the list. THE BEST TOPICS. THE BEST CONVERSTION ON
METEORITES COINCIDED WITH THE MOST ADS. So a big part of this whole
topic is BULLSHIT. If you really want to do it right for THE FIRST
TIME -have a real vote. I HAVE BEEN ON THIS LIST LONGER THAN 70% of
the folks on this list. So if you want a true historical perspective
maybe ask someone who's been here a lot longer than the critics...
Michael Cottingham
On Oct 15, 2009, at 12:13 PM, dean bessey wrote:
<The fact seems to be forgotten that a consensus was taken by Art
about advertising in his forum. Advertising is a privilege, not a
right and Art was considering having no ads at all due to abuse.
The consensus, at the time, was that way too many ads were being
posted and that one-ad-per-week should be a rule. List members
input was taken into account so this was not only Art's wishes but
the majority of other members as well.> <SNIP>
This is flat out wrong. There never was any consensus. Art went on
record as saying that he did not mind ads.
What happened was that 4 or 5 people decided that they would hijack
Art's list as if it was their own and decide to prevent people from
making "to many" (Whatever that means) ads. After months and months
of bombarding the list with anti ad attack postings Art basically
tried to shut up the malcontents that dont appriciate the fact that
they have the privelidge being a part of what is basically the best
online meteorite forum and said "OK, one a week".
Then, rather than shut up, these 4 or 5 people decide to declare
themselves sherrif and kept going on with this anti ad campaign and
even the most minor offence (Even during big shows like tucson and
munich) was enough to make attack postings. They decided to continue
making an ass of themselves and continue their efforts to hijack
arts list as if it was their own.
Then after people started leaving the list because of all these
attack postings they had the gall to claim that "They left because
of the ads". (The fact that people werent leaving before their
hijacking and attacking efforts is conveniently ignored).
Nobody leaves this list because of the ads (Well there may have been
2 or 3 people who left because they are to stupid to use the delete
button or block sender button in their email settings and dislaike
the fact that people are allowed to own meteorites like the cultural
property people in some governments but its an insignificant few).
People leave because of the bickering. Dont try and twist it around
that its not because of those 4 or 5 people that is basically
ruining things for everybody.
Becides why are you 4 or 5 people constantly harrassing the other
1000 of us with your diatrabes? An iq of about six would enable you
to understand that the only person who matters is art so why dont
you email him rather than the rest of us who cant do anything even
if we did buy the fact that you somehow have the right to
unilaterally declare yourselves sherrif even though you have no
ownership or control of this list?
The answer of course is that Art has the smarts to ignore the
whackos.
Nobody is forcing anybody to be a part of this list. You dont even
need arts permission to leave. You can do it yourself.
Stop this assanine BS and let us talk meteorites and have sales. If
you have a problem dont complain to the other 1000 of us.
And the "Majority consensus" that you refer to is about the same as
what the "Majority consensus" of an iranian election would be. It is
flat out not the will of the majority of list members or the list
owner but the will of 4 or 5 people who wants to run the list as
they see fit (Like the aftermat of an Iranian election).
I suspect that cottingshams lastest excessive postings are designed
to entertain and see how big an ass that certain paople can make of
themselves by complaining about them. Some people has posted 2 anti
ad attacks for every one of cottingshams supposedly excessive ads.
The other 1000 of us are surely happy about that.
Go away. The consensus of the silent majority dont want to listen to
your attacks anymore
Sincerely
DEAN
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.........................................................
Michael Gilmer (Florida, USA)
Member of the Meteoritical Society.
Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
FaceBook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale
Twitter - Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone
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..........................................................
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