...and, Hi Mike too, nice to hear from you - not exactly back, just
blowing a bit of steam from my pressure cooker and showing my e-face;
$50 on eBay will get you an authentic Buran brick (just search for tile
buran), like this:
ttp://www.buran-energia.com/boutique-shop/product_info.php?products_id=36
Very cool - Well worth it if you like space nostalgia
Best wishes
Doug
-----Original Message-----
From: John.L.Cabassi <[email protected]>
To: 'Michael Gilmer' <[email protected]>; 'MexicoDoug'
<[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected]
Sent: Sun, Jun 26, 2011 11:26 am
Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Moon Dust
http://www.thespaceshop.com/shuttilin.html
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
Michael Gilmer
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 8:20 AM
To: MexicoDoug
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Moon Dust
Hi Doug and List,
Doug - it is great to see you posting again. I have missed your
insights. :)
They are selling heat tiles from the shuttles at KSC? I didn't know
that, and I want one!
I've been meaning to acquire some more space-related items - aerogel,
heat shield tiles, etc.
Do they have a website where I can order the tiles, or do I need to
visit the gift shop in person?
Best regards,
MikeG
PS - is there somewhere online to buy the Russian tiles also?
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564
------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------
On 6/25/11, MexicoDoug <[email protected]> wrote:
JG wrote to MG:
"What law are you talking about?"
Ditto! A fact-supported discussion would be so much nicer.
It is my understanding that when Apollo lost its funding, oodles of
relics entered the private domain and there wasn't much ado about it -
rather, a tacit acceptance and a party atmosphere pervaded in the wake
of Moonphoria and non had any scientific value at the time. Where are
the retroactive vigorous sting operations hunting down these national
treasures? I am sure the same "laws", whatever they might be, cover
them.
Post-facto contrived rules are a violation which seems to date to the
Magna Carta and any remotely civilized society. All material loaned or
provided in exchange for analyses to be done which is covered by
modern agreements (as Jeff alludes to) has a clear paper trail, but
there are the nonsensical cases like tape on the Hasselblad magazines
demonstrate how ludicrous things can become for reasons foreign to
science and domestic to collectors willingness to pay. I take my place
behind the line of those who have already pointed this out.
Moon specimens that were incidental and innocuous gifts of
questionable or no value at the time seem to have taken a special
place. But, there are other exceptions as well. As I peruse the aisles
of the gift shop at KSC I am tempted to buy a Space Shuttle heat tile.
Yet NASA has allegedly gone on record saying that it will not dispose
of them by sale to the public (reason: we could be liable for
unintended harm they might cause). Rumor has it that the Soviet Buran
tiles are more interesting to collect and Russia has no such hang ups
over them, so I'll hold out for one of them. If I had an American one
it would not be satisfying in present company. I couldn't freely share
it with my international friends without risking being thrown in jail
for providing sensitive military secrets to other nations... at least
that is the rumor on how it was for a long time ...
There is a clear demonstration of double standard and a willingness to
invent retroactive laws, which should be prohibited constitutionally,
but the American system separates the judicial and that makes
legislation from the bench a convenient option in cases like this. How
frustrating for Mr. Rosen, the guy who bought the gifted moon rock
from a Honduran official for a large sum of money. The government
simply snatched it from him and it was not because the Hondurans filed
a claim. If he had been compensated for his recovery of the specimen
it would be different in my view. But the way it went down, there is
reason to be wary of the court's freeloading and arbitrary mindset in
these cases. It is quite removed from science and boils down to
politics and setting cruel and unusual precedents at the expense of
citizens for prior shoddy control practices. Mr. Rosen, the owner at
the time of the Moon rock was never charged with any criminal activity
- they just took the rock plaque and left him to brood. If they could
have charged him I sort of think they would have given the zest to
make examples out of people. But they got what they wanted - a
precedent of no-ownership when before there was none to my knowledge.
I would point out that this nonsensical legal gymnastic that seems to
have developed ought to be applied to each and every scientist in the
United States that is on any payroll or grant for a project who
supposedly buys specimens in his free time. How different is such
piggybacking from the microgram residues on a piece of tape out of a
camera? How did Dr. King amass that huge personal collection on many
field trips to places such as, aw, forget it. Not worth going into, it
would be more counterproductive than good to go there.
Best wishes
Doug
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Grossman <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sat, Jun 25, 2011 8:34 pm
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Moon Dust
What law are you talking about?
On 6/25/2011 7:55 PM, Michael Gilmer wrote:
Hi Jeff and List,
What strikes me here is that NASA has 842 pounds of lunar material
and
they are apparently bent out shape over a few milligrams of dust
clinging to a piece of scotch tape. It's absolutely silly and it
speaks of skewed priorities.
It was mentioned to me in private email by a respected list member
that the NASA samples in question were not addressed by the law until
1972. If that is true, then it seems to me that any sample removed
legally prior to that date would be "grand-fathered in" as legal.
A relevant example would be trinitite. Trinitite removed before the
law specifically addressed it is legal. However, going to the site
now and removing trinitite is illegal. Another example would be
Canyon Diablo iron meteorites - those CD meteorites removed before
the
"prohibition" are legal. Those removed today are illegal because one
must trespass to get them. The devil is in the details - how does one
distinguish a legal Diablo meteorite from an illegal one? And how
would one determine a legal piece of dusty tape from an illegal one?
ATTENTION GOVERNMENT - STOP PISSING AWAY OUR TAX MONEY CHASING AFTER
DUSTY TAPE! Instead, here are some suggestions for using our tax
money - build homes for the homeless, feed the hungry, offer medical
care to the sick, create jobs for the unemployed, fund the sciences,
or any number of things that are more important than dusty tape.
Best regards,
MikeG
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