Here's a bit of what we are going through in terms of a new direction for a
replacement CAM package...
Note, all names have been X'ed out to protect my butt. However, I think yous
will find it interesting. Read on!
Since we were first notified that SmartCam was being absorbed into SDRC for
development of their Generative Machining CAM package we have been looking
for an eventual replacement. I was instructed by xxx xxxxxx and xxx
xxxxxxxx, ( then xxx Tooling Manager and xxx Tooling and Equipment
Supervisor) to look for a suitable replacement. We wanted to be sure we
didn't become reliant on CAM software that would become obsolete. As
suspected SmartCam v11.5 still has the same bugs as when released, technical
support is almost nil and our area rep is trying to sell us other CAM
packages. The schools in the area no longer offer SmartCam training so any
training would have to be developed in house. Ultimately we would be the
only users of SmartCam, a language as dead as Latin.
xxxxxx Engineering of course is fully committed to PTC software. PRO/E may
be a fine CAD tool and many other PRO modules may be equally as fine. The
desire of Engineering Management is for us on the shop floor to replace
SmartCam with PRO/NC as they have already purchased numerous licenses of
PRO/NC. So far our resources for developing the use of PRO/NC have been
very, very limited. It has also proven to be very difficult to get any in
depth training or even to find anyone using PRO/NC in an environment like
ours, (non-production).
I was told by xxx xxxxx, my current Supervisor, that at the annual tooling
meeting there in xxxxxx xxxx xxxxxxx would announce that henceforth all
xxxxxx xxxxxxxxx would use PTC CAD and CAM products and no others would be
considered. I have not heard any further information on that. I work for
xxxxxx and if Tooling Management tells me I am to build dies with skinning
knives and bone saws I'll give it my best shot.
We have looked at a number of CAM packages and liked MasterCam the best.
Granted it is not SmartCam. I think the thing most of us liked best about
SmartCam was the total control of toolpaths. No other CAM software I've
looked at allows as much freedom of toolpath control as SmartCam. MasterCam
is the leading CAM software in the world. It leads by a 5 to 1 ratio here in
the Northwest. It is taught at the Community Colleges and some of our
apprentices are even taking it there. So there is training, support and a
good chance to hire people that know the software if we need to. There is
also a direct translator available to import PRO/E solid models into
MasterCam solid models.
I program an average of 54 jobs a month here with each job requiring 1-7
seperate operations just for the CNC mills in the tooling department. I am
not sure the same thing could be accomplished with just one programmer using
PRO/NC. It certainly has not been demonstrated by anyone at any time that I
know of. To be fair, we will never know unless we try but "try" means a
fulltime commitment by some dedicated resources to develop and use PRO/NC.
I am pretty sure you will get your look at PRO this century. If you don't
have the time needed to learn it and implement it you may not want to see
it. It can get frustrating when your out there alone trying to accomplish
something and you still are expected to keep the spindles in the shop going.
I guess we'll have to just wait and see what direction is set by management
and do the best we can. Maybe some year we'll be included in the annual
tooling meeting and can compare our progress on that set direction.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Guse [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2000 11:51 PM
To: Mike Gailey; Michael Senack; SMARTCAM
Subject: Re: [mfg-smartcam] Communicate install
Management decided that because Smartcam/Camax is dead, it
was time to get a
more "up to date" cam package. They decided on Unigraphics.
After messing
with UG for a few weeks I have come to the conclusion that
if it can do it
with 2-1/2 axis, Smartcam can do it better, get it faster,
and with less
input. I have also concluded that Camax can easily
outperform UG in 3 axis
work. UG can still outperform Smartcam in 3 axis, but just
barely. It took
me 3 days to program a roughing program in UG for a retainer
plate in a
mold. I could have done it in 2 hours in Smartcam.
When it comes to customization by the end user, Smartcam is
so far ahead of
the game that there is no comparison. The same can be said
for training and
ease of use. Our local UG rep was actually proud that in
order to use UG
the end user needs to go to 4 weeks worth of classes. He
told me that there
was no way possible that I could have learned Production
Milling in 3 days.
I was also told that UG needs to be difficult because it's
the only way a
cam program can be powerful.
Smartcam's code generators actually do work. UG Post works
after a week of
hacking away at it by the end user with no tech support from
UG. I was told
by tech support that I was talking "over their heads." I
never talked over
anybody's head when getting support for Smartcam. He
finally sent out his
local tech support guy. After two hours of looking at my
post the local
tech told me that what I was trying to do was impossible.
UG's idea of
using a post to drill holes is to send X/Y coordinates to
the NC and let the
operator on the shop floor edit in the speeds, feeds, canned
cycles, and any
other required code. The same can be said for any toolpath
requiring the
use of G41/G42. All by myself I finally did get UG to
output the proper
code in the right order so it at least bears a somewhat
close resemblance to
something coming from Smartcam.
As far as I can tell, UG lacks any support for subprograms.
I was told that
nobody uses subprograms. What I programmed today in
Smartcam must be
something that nobody will use.
I never was a big fan of the new Smartcam tool list, mostly
because I always
had trouble getting it to do what I wanted. But I always
could use the
toollist.tmp from ver. 8.0 and get exactly what I wanted. I
printed a tool
list from UG. 7 pages for 11 tools and it didn't tell the
operator anything
useful. It did spit out some really nice pretty pictures in
the list.
Smartcam has the better GUI by far. UG requires the end
user to wade
through seemingly endless dialog boxes with cryptic labels
just to spot
drill one lousy hole. Smartcam requires just 3 (setting up
the tool,
setting up the operation, and drilling the hole). You can
skip the first
two by importing a jof file from a previous job, thus really
saving time.
I quickly learned that UG's idea of a graphical toolpath
editor means
deleting a toolpath, changing a bunch of parameter settings,
and
regenerating the toolpath hoping that it comes out right.
Everybody here
knows what Smartcam lets the operator do to toolpath that
needs a bit of
tweaking.
So my advise to SDRC is to get off their lazy butts, rehire
the Smartcam
brain trust, and then get out of the way and let them
restart development on
the best all around cam package. My advise to anybody
contemplating on
getting UG: buy stock in a drug company first and then buy
the aspirin in
the extra large economy size bottles. The only good news is
management is
starting to have second thoughts about UG.
Jeff Guse
FFM User
Disgruntled UG user with a very bad headache
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Gailey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Michael Senack" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "SMARTCAM"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2000 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: [mfg-smartcam] Communicate install
> I would like to add that Smartcam is still probably the
best program ever
> killed and left for dead. I still can't see why it wasn't
updated and
given new
> life. I look at lots of other cam software, none of which
yet compare to
> Smartcam.
> Long live Smartcam!
> Michael
>
> Michael Senack wrote:
>
> > Absolutely yes. We do it here. We have a dedicated
computer on the shop
> > floor as a file sever hooked up to a 6 way switch box.
We also installed
> > Edit Plus so the operators can view the files if need
be, before
> > downloading. Also, they can use Edit Plus to make minor
changes so the
> > program will run on both Agie wire machines.
> > Our MIS department checked with SDRC about running
multiple copies of
> > Communicate and Edit Plus on more seats than was
licensed for and they
had
> > no problem with it. Since SmartCAM is a dead product and
there is no
SDRC
> > support what the heck!
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Steve Buck
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2000 9:11 AM
> > To: SmartCam user Group
> > Subject: [mfg-smartcam]
Communicate install
> >
> > Can I install Communicate on a computer
that only will
have
> > Communicate
> > on it?
> >
> > Steve
> > ATM
> >
> >
> >
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> > To find out more about this mailing list
including how
to
> > unsubscribe,
> > send the message "info mfg-smartcam" to
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >
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> >
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to unsubscribe,
> > send the message "info mfg-smartcam" to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
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>
> --
> Visit us at http://www.microsystemsgeorgia.com/toc.htm
for
> Smartcam and Rhino information.
>
>
>
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