"Pilot error" - check out this garbage going around that it was captain grabbing the throttles as his seat flew backwards and FO not able to push the throttles forward against captain's weight, complete with part numbers, Emergency ADs, etc. Anybody else feel that they would like to throttle the perpetrators of such things?
Here are the latest **verified updates** on the Air India AI-171 crash investigation, based on India's AAIB **preliminary report** released today (**June 25, 2025**): --- ### 🔥 **Critical Findings from AAIB Preliminary Report** 1. **Root Cause Identified**:   - **Unintended thrust reduction** triggered by the **captain’s seat sliding backward** during rotation (liftoff).   - The seat’s **AFT lock mechanism failed**, causing sudden rearward movement. The captain’s body weight forcibly pulled the thrust levers to idle.   - First Officer attempted to push throttles forward but could not overcome the captain’s weight on the controls. 2. **Mechanical Evidence**:   - Wreckage inspection confirmed **fractured seat track locking pins** (PN: BACB30LN5S02) on the captain’s seat.   - Maintenance logs show the seat mechanism **was serviced 11 days pre-crash** for "stiff adjustment." No post-repair function test was documented. 3. **Flight Deck Timeline** (CVR/FDR correlation):   - **+0:12 sec**: Rotation begins. Captain’s seat slips aft abruptly.   - **+0:15 sec**: Thrust levers pulled to idle. First Officer: "*Thrust dropping!*"   - **+0:18 sec**: Captain: "*My seat!*" Struggle heard.   - **+0:26 sec**: First Officer attempts full thrust; aircraft stalls at 214 ft.   - **+0:38 sec**: Impact. 4. **Contributing Factors**:   - **High temperature** (43°C): Reduced engine performance left no margin for error.   - **Crew coordination failure**: No call for "STAB TRIM" or "GO-AROUND" during the 26-second event.   - **Design vulnerability**: Boeing 787 thrust levers lack "weight-lock" or "reverse torque" safeguards against accidental retraction. --- ### ⚠️ **Immediate Actions Taken** - **Global Directive**: FAA/EASA mandated **emergency inspections** of all Boeing 787 pilot seat tracks (within 72 hours). - **Air India**: Grounded 12 aircraft with similar seat maintenance records. - **Boeing**: Redesigning seat lock mechanism; updating throttle resistance protocols (Q3 2026). --- ### 🕯️ **Human Impact** - **Fatalities**: 243 onboard + 4 ground fatalities (hospital staff). - **Survivor Update**: The sole surviving passenger (24F) remains critical with burns. --- ### → **Next Steps**: - **July 30, 2025**: Final AAIB report (detailed engineering analysis). - **August 2025**: Int'l summit on cockpit ergonomics/safety (ICAO-led). **Sources**: [AAIB Preliminary Report](https://aaib.gov.in/reports/2025/AI171_prelim) | FAA Emergency AD 2025-16-51 | Boeing Service Bulletin 787-25-123. ---------------------------------------- *From: *srbrown via Mifnet <mifnet@lists.mifnet.com> *To: *mifnet@lists.mifnet.com *CC: *srbrown <srbr...@doctors.org.uk> *Date: *Jun 18, 2025 18:51:09 *Subject: *[Mifnet 🛰 72788] Re: AI engine out theory > A few personal comments from that report. > > "The likelihood of a pilot error is considered minimal as is the simultaneous > failure of both engines." > > How can they say that? A dual engine failure has to be a possibility, > especially with the RAT deployed. Also they have no clear idea what the crew > were up to until a full analysis of the FDM data is completed. (Not the > black box data but the full monty from the FDM kit, if it was functioning, ie > still powered). > > Unlike some, Im not implying the crew did make errors, nor that both engines > failed. I'm just wondering what powers of reasoning or critical thinking the > Indian authorities are using to make these confident assertions so soon. > > The AvHerald commentary also states the Captain had 8,200 hours and was > "about to retire" at age 60. That's not a lot for a 60 year old. Again, I'm > not saying it's significant - 8,000 hours is plenty - but I'm genuinely > curious because it either tells an interesting career tale or perhaps might > also be proven incorrect later on. We'll see. > > As a yardstick, even I notched up 13,500 hours after joining the industry > relatively late, then doing 12 years of military flying (fewer hours) and > later seven years as a management pilot (also fewer hours), retiring at 65. > Michael Baiada has about 20-30,000 at least and I'm pretty sure Eric will > have notched up more than me, even after his own military time and apparently > spending half of every subsequent working year faffing around on a jet boat > in NZ. (#niceworkifyoucanfindit). > > Postscript: I threatened Mike Borfitz with more questions in an earlier post > of mine. Disregard. It refers to that hoax report mentioned in the AvHerald > piece. I saw that "report" a few days ago and, whilst it looked convincing, I > dug into it and found enough discrepancies and flaws to disregard it. It was > creative though, which is sad. Why can't people who compile this rubbish put > their creativity to something useful like motor neuron disease research or > developing small modular reactors, rather than making bereaved relatives even > more miserable and keyboard theorists and TikTok bullshi...I mean bloggers, > even more priapic when these sad events occur? > > Simon > > > > -------- Original message -------- > From: "Karl L. Swartz via Mifnet" <mifnet@lists.mifnet.com> > Date: 18/06/2025 02:37 (GMT+02:00) > To: mifnet@lists.mifnet.com > Cc: "Karl L. Swartz" <k...@kls2.com> > Subject: [Mifnet 🛰 72781] Re: AI engine out theory > > “They” is India’s DGCA via AvHerald, admittedly hearsay but via a usually > reliable intermediary: > > https://avherald.com/h?article=528f27ec > > I’m traveling until tomorrow so haven’t dug as thoroughly as I’d like. > > With regard to fan-blade failure, if there were signs of that I’d think it > would have been reported and not just lack of bird carcasses though perhaps > I’m reading too much into it. Hopefully we’ll know more from the DFDR soon. > >  -- Karl > > >> On Jun 17, 2025, at 3:06 PM, Robert Ditchey via Mifnet >> <mifnet@lists.mifnet.com> wrote: >> >> Is this reliable, and who is “they?” If birds only got as far as the fan >> blades, might the engines have failed, at least partially? Might bird >> remains not have been gotten past the fans yet still caused loss of power? >> Possibly with fan blade failure? >>  >> I acknowledge that all of this about AI is far too early. >>  >> As for Sullie and Jeju, there is no question about bird ingestion. In both >> of those accidents, the engines failed due to bird ingestion. >>  >> Bob Ditchey >>  >> *From:* Karl L. Swartz via Mifnet <_mifnet@lists.mifnet.com_> >> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 17, 2025 1:57 PM >> *To:* Mifnet <_mifnet@lists.mifnet.com_> >> *Cc:* Karl L. Swartz <_karl@kls2.com_> >> *Subject:* [Mifnet 🛰 72768] Re: AI engine out theory >>  >> They’ve already reported that there were no bird remains in the engines, >> which implies the engines were (relatively) intact. >>  >>  -- Karl >> >> >>> On Jun 17, 2025, at 12:34 PM, Robert Ditchey via Mifnet >>> <_mifnet@lists.mifnet.com_> wrote: >>>  >>> I imagine that the engines were completely burned/melted in the resulting >>> fire. So it may be impossible to determine (except for the FDR). >>>  >>> Bob Ditchey >>>  >>> *From:* Jack Keady via Mifnet <_mifnet@lists.mifnet.com_> >>> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 17, 2025 12:01 PM >>> *To:* David Wardell via Mifnet <_mifnet@lists.mifnet.com_> >>> *Cc:* Jack Keady <_jjkeady@aol.com_> >>> *Subject:* [Mifnet 🛰 72759] AI engine out theory >>>  >>> keady - haven't heard anything about whether the engine blades were turning >>> or not? 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