On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 09:52:18PM +0530, Karthik Kumar wrote: | > Perhaps you're *USING* these 4 files to install the adobe flash player | > on your machine (your example a little bit later in this mail seems to | > indicate you have at least installed it). That's non-free software | > you've installed, but you are free to do so. Then, to you, those four | > small files are not so useless, are they ? | > | | Okay, I didn't install it. But it's like saying 'There is no proof | that the Makefiles won't work unless at least one person has installed | them and verified". In any case, I put forward the argument that the | Makefiles are useless because no single person has reported a | successful install with them. BooHoo!
You are making an argument that Makefiles are useless when we are discussing the free-ness of OpenBSD. It doesn't have a lot to do with the subject at hand (again...), but there you go. First of all, you ridicule yourself with this argument. Of course people have tested this particular (and all the other) ports. People have installed them and verified them. In fact, some years ago, when I needed to use flash on my OpenBSD system, I did the same. Works perfectly. The Makefiles work fine, people use them and it has been known to work for quite some time now. These people want or have to use a free Operating System (OpenBSD) for whatever reason they have. Now they want or have to use non-free flash. They install it and use it. It's useful to the people requiring this software to be able to install it through the portstree. It's not causing you any harm if you prefer not to use it, nor does it do any damage to the free-ness of OpenBSD. | > But you're not complaining that these (FREE) files are useless. | > There's almost 5000 ports in the tree now, you are not using them all | > (you're not even using all the ports for free programs) so there's a | > lot more to complain about if that was your gripe. I've made an effort | > to reply to your argument but we were discussing the free-ness of | > OpenBSD, not the usefulness. Please stick to the subject and do not | > try to divert the discussion to unrelated matters. | | No, i'm talking about the usefulness of your supposedly free (and | useful) makefiles in installing nonfree software. Yes, completely irrelevant when discussing how free OpenBSD is. Stick to the subject. You said OpenBSD should not call itself free because you think it's not free. I've shown how it *IS* free and asked you to prove me wrong. You reply with irrelevant arguments about usefulness when we are discussing freedom. | > Here's a nice trick. On any OpenBSD system simply do the following : | > | > ftp http://tinyurl.com/83kyc | > | | Have you performed the above step too? Shame on you for using | Microsoft PowerPoint .. or whatever it is you people use. I did, I tested the above procedure before sending my mail to the list. Doesn't mean I've used it, but if you think it's shameful to prove you wrong, I think that says more about you than about me. | > Et voila ! You now have non-free software on your system. It is the | > Microsoft PowerPoint Viewer (it's gratis (doesn't cost money) but it's | > not open source). You did this with free software (ftp from OpenBSD) ! | > Ohnoes ! That software (OpenBSD ftp) isn't free, I can use it to | > download non-free software ! | > | > Boohoo. Now explain again how this makes OpenBSD any less free. | > | > After your 'make install' in /usr/ports/www/opera-flashplugin, *YOU* | > have installed libflashplayer.so on your system. Why does that make | > OpenBSD any less free ? | > | | Like I already replied to someone: They put a cigarette pack in | OpenBSD with the warning: 'Smoking causes Cancer'. They say it's there | but you're not supposed to smoke it. It's not going to harm you unless | you smoke it. Do you see the analogy? You still have not shown any file in the OpenBSD cvs repository that is not free. You make gratuitous analogies that are completely irrelevant - try to stick to the subject, no analogies necessary. There's no cigarettes in OpenBSD, it's all free bits of software etc. Could you please point us to non-free software in the cvs repository now ? I'm replying to all your nonsensical arguments but you fail to give me the one thing I've been asking you for quite some time now. I will concede once you show me a non-free file in the OpenBSD cvs repository. If you can not show me such a file, it would not hurt to publicly state that you were wrong when you said that OpenBSD does not deserve the title 'Free'. Paul 'WEiRD' de Weerd -- >++++++++[<++++++++++>-]<+++++++.>+++[<------>-]<.>+++[<+ +++++++++++>-]<.>++[<------------>-]<+.--------------.[-] http://www.weirdnet.nl/
