Hi blue-jay maple and welcome to the discussion. I enjoyed your post and found a relevant link you might find helpful:
http://www.twitter.com Right on! ________________________________ From: blue-jay maple <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, June 6, 2009 11:48:28 AM Subject: Re: [MD] NAP The NAP is applied in the free market. The free market is everywhere. It is only where production takes place. The scale is free market - socialism - communism. Any government intervention in the free market where production takes place is socialism (a mixture of private and government exchange) such as any regulations, the Federal Reserve (not born of the free market), and bailouts that include government take-overs. Communism is full blown government owned institutions throughout the society. Socialism and communism are redistribution activities of the means of production with communism being government intervention the whole way along the economic process. Socialism happens in various degrees between free market and communism. Socialism is government intervention, but the private sector still exists. Socialism and communism involve centralized planning and redistribution of wealth. Both of these coerce the free market of the production it makes. All governments are socialist in one form or another due to the government intervening whether to tax, provide self-defense, or do economic planning. Some governments are more socialist than others, meaning, they intervene in the spontaneous free market activities more than others. To understand economic planning in the U.S. and most countries is to understand Keynesian economics. It does not recognize the individual consumer and this has always been it's difficulty. Bernanke, Geithner, and Paulson and others before them have been Keynesian economists. This dates back to about the 1920's/30's that Keynesians became the intellectuals the government used. They admit in their own writings that they can't account for the consumer and therefore all their economic planning involves mathematical models that try figure out the economy. It never works. It never has. Keynesians point to logical positivism as their philosophy. They can't understand value. They don't understand free choice and call the powers that control consumers "animal spirits". Keynes himself came up with that concept. One of the most damaging activities Keynesians do, in the central bank, is artificially control interest rates. When interest rates are low this encourages investing. The interest rates are low and so investors put their capital into activities that produce. Because the interest rates are artificially pushed down, this means the free market is not giving indicators that interest rates need to go down. What this does, and has done for decades since the beginning of the Federal Reserve, is cause numerous malinvestments to happen. This is the bubble being inflated. Interest rates are artifically low and the central bank is handing out billions of dollars in credit. For example, the housing bubble. More houses were built than needed, but the Federal Reserve hands out low interest credit to certain parts of the economy and cause malinvestments and a huge malinvestment happened in the housing sector. The State of California is actually tearing down houses cause too many were built. By tearing down the houses that nobody bought the Federal Reserve and California is trying to stop the prices of houses from dropping. Low demand = lower prices = poor people can afford a house. But they aren't letting this happen. They are artifically keeping the prices of houses from dropping by printing huge amounts of money. The biggest bubble right now is the monetary bubble. This would have not happened if the Dot.com bubble would have been allowed to burst all the way and clear the market of malinvestments. The government stepped in and stopped it from bursting. That kept the malinvestments in the market with government backing them. This thereby lead to Bear Stearns, AIG, and others taking on all these malinvestments more and more. So another huge bubble grew the housing bubble. But that needed to burst too. So now the economy has large amounts of malinvestments in it. They are worth - nothing, nada, but the government is keeping their doors open. If this bubble was allowed to burst back in September this would be all over by now according to free market analysts. For instance, the 1920 depression was two times worse than the Great Depression. But it only lasted for about two years. Why? Cause the government didn't intervene. The Great Depression lasted for twenty years. Why? Cause the government wouldn't let malinvestments to clear out of the market and let the market have clarity. The government kept handing out bad credit. The private sector shrunk in the Great Depression and it wasn't over until after World War Two when the government cut taxes and cut spending that the Great Depression was over. FDR didn't stop the Great Depression. He didn't create jobs in the private sector. He ballooned the governments jobs with public works. But government doesn't produce anything. The government can involve people in public work projects but this ends up pushing out the private sector and causes another problem on the private sector. The government outcompetes with the private sector, bidding lower on projects. But the government isn't creating jobs. It's taxing real producers to redistribute their money to people working for the government. Taxing and giving back isn't making money, isn't earning the money, isn't producing anything. Unemployment dropped during World War Two. Why? Cause over 1 million men were drafted to fight in the war. GDP rose, but not in the private sector. Only to make bombs and ammo. Not until after World War Two did the Great Depression finally end in real private sector growth cause the government stopped intervening in the free market. The free market is the exchange of economic goods, ideas, and reasoning without physical coercion. A civil society (spontaneous order) involves the free market. The government/State is coercive by nature and is paternal and totalitarian in various degrees by nature. Socialism is an economic and a governmental application that is coercive by nature. There are voluntary socialists, but they are planning as a community a way to go about their exchanges and civility to various extents. These are surmised to be able to happen without governmental interference, but it is not free market. It is controlling outcomes whereas the free market doesn't. I doubt voluntary socialist societies will actually last long, for one, they can only occur based parasitically off of a free market to control and plan the exchanges. And that's what governments do. They don't produce anything. They can only exist by parasitically feeding off of the free market civil society. -- Be Yourself @ mail.com! Choose From 200+ Email Addresses Get a Free Account at www.mail.com Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
