Ian, The zeros are there and cannot be ignored (one would think), but from what I heard of the Top Quark discovery at Fermilab it doesn't take much for them to cry Victory, there is much too much invested in the Standard Model. Did you happen to see the movie 'Dark Matter'? I know it's just a movie, but it's making legitimate claims about the ??? Well, if you get a chance see the movie.
Marsha -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ian Glendinning Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2009 8:21 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [MD] principle of complimentarity Hi Ron, Marsha, I like that "Objectivly speaking, reality is a dream within a dream within a dream...et infinum" I have used "The dreams that stuff are made from" to bastardize the bard - though I didn't coin that version. Just for the record the limitations are not within the "measuring devices" - but with the very concept of measurement, given current received wisdom of fundamental physics. FYI - my current view is one level lower than either particles or waves - quantum information - where wave-particle complemenarity are just two views of the same information. We'll have to wait for that expensive piece of kit in Switzerland to be a complete failure (or disaster) before much of the world notices though. The guys with the funding have the wrong maths - Einstein corrected his error, but still very few have noticed post-Copenhagen. Ian. On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 2:09 PM, X Acto<[email protected]> wrote: > Marsha, > > I believe it seems to exclude a particles momentum or trajectory simply because > of the limits of the measuring devices and the gravitational effects it has on them. > > For starters, mainly because particles are not really entities or substances but an intersection > of fields of force. > As I understand it, particles are layers apon layers of said intersections built up from a backround > of these fields of "force" for lack of a better word, manifesting in strong and weak atomic forces. > > The popular theory at the moment, which the super collider hoped to verify, was that all of this > is a manifestation of the field of space, or string theory, that space is composed of fluctuating > quantum rings. > Objectivly speaking, reality is a dream within a dream within a dream...et infinum > > so measuring is a bit of a problem, objectivly. Complimentrarity, says that these particles > and forces only exist in relation to eachother. to isolate them and calculte their trajectory > is misunderstanding them, it creates paradox. like the particle/wave duality, the duality > lies in how the phenomena is measured not in the phenomena itself. > > So to conclude, the problem is in how physicists understand particles and the limits of the > methods of measurement. > > -Ron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: MarshaV <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2009 6:27:27 AM > Subject: [MD] principle of complimentarity > > Greetings, > > > > Why is it that if we perform an experiment to determine a quantum particle's > position, it excludes knowing only the particle's momentum and not > everything else? > > > > > > Marsha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____________ > > > > "He who neglects the present moment throws away all he has." > (Friedrich von Schiller) > > > > > > > > > > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
