On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 10:08 PM, Ham Priday <[email protected]> wrote:
> > On 8/12 at 2:33 PM John Carl wrote -- > > > I don't believe self is an illusion. I believe self is a choice. >> Or let me put it this way, the self as a static entity is illusory >> as an object, but the *existence* of a self is the self-evident >> choice of consciousness. >> > > I like your definition of the self as "choice." It complements my concept > of "value sensibility" by imbuing it with action. Actually, I believe that > the act of experiencing is making a choice, rather than passively receiving > external information. That choice shapes our objective reality to represent > our value-sensibility. > Right, you can't make a choice unless you have values and something to choose from - which "values-sensibility" does describe succinctly and accurately. > > > Self as entity is real. >> > > It is certainly the most intimate reality we can know. Paradoxically, it's > the most difficult entity to define. Perhaps that is because "knowing" is for me and "defining" is for other. I know my self, but defining it for your satisfaction can be problematic. Especially if you make it so! > In fact, I think it's easier to come up with a conception of the primary > source (Creator or Essence) than to peg selfness as the locus of conscious > awareness. > > The contents of this entity are illusory as objects. >> > > Yes, and the Pirsigians tend to regard the knowing self as illusory too. > Their definition of the subject as a "collection of interactive patterns" > hardly qualifies as an existing entity. Yet, my Internet search for a > proper definition has born no fruit. Isn't it ironic that, after thousands > of years, the greatest minds in history have been unable to fathom exactly > what a "mind" is? And yet, they seem to be using theirs in an effort to evade this fathoming. You'd think that'd be a clue of some kind, eh? John Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
