Interesting again DMB, very interesting. Don't know where to start. I will happily respond to each point if you wish ...
Just three for starters ... (1) Where have I ever defended Dawkins ... I in fact regularly attack him and his hyper-objective reductionist viewpoint as being a major part of the problem ... one of the few people I can be bothered to actually attack in fact. (In fact I recall you attacking me for daring to attack him in the "End of Faith" debates a year or two ago.) (2) I don't doubt your Rand friend reports what you say. I'm defending game theory (and system theory and network theory and social evolutionary models like the MoQ - well post-Darwin). What I'm not defending is people who put dumb objective (SOMist) assumptions about what the "rational agents" are in these models. I'm also as is my habit, pointing out that demonizing Nash (or anyone else individually) as the sole creator of either the theories, or the defense and economic applications that took them up, as so simplistic that it is unhelpful. (3) I'm not suggesting either that these misguided assumptions are no longer operable in mainstream economics and politics (right or liberal). What I'm doing is saying, that if we identify the wrong problem - like luddites - smash the computers and tools, rather than the dumb ideas people put them into use for, then we are unlikely to achieve a better solution. And in fact I'm doing a lot more than that - I am active in several campaigns and other forums via my blog in actively bringing "autistic economics" and the like and the "amoral" value-less mis-application of "science" to the attention of as many people in positions of power and influence as I can. (PS - Anyone manage to see episode 2. I can't seem to get that one to work. Episode 3, by the way seems to support my view of the "simplistication" and hypocrisy problems - we can discuss that too.) Dave, if you can spare my sensitive soul your withering personally directed sarcsam, I would gladly debate the points in this thread in much further detail. They are very close to my heart, in fixing what is rotten in the state of global economics and politics - there is no other game in town for the foreseeable. Regards Ian On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 8:26 PM, david buchanan<[email protected]> wrote: > > Ian said to Craig: > I did try to point out that (with the obvious political motivations) it > blurred right across from poker, fuck-you, through prisoners dilemma and the > hostage / valuable dilemmas ... that any actual value of game theories (and > later systems and network theories) were simplisticated out of all > recognition. > > > dmb says: > This reminds me of the times you've tried to defend the genetic reductionism > of Richard Dawkins, social Darwinism, systems theory and a whole bunch of > intellectual garbage that represents the kind of amoral rationality that > Pirsig has identified as a cultural crisis. It's drivel, man. > On top of that, I happen to be good friends with a tenured professor of > economics who also works as an associate at Rand. We talked about the model > of human behavior that comes out of Nash's equations and I can tell you that > they still form the basis of economic theory in this country. And if you want > a "common sense" assessment, all you have to do is listen to what today's > conservatives are saying. They're giving voice to Hayek and Nash's vision in > the current health care debate and you can also hear it in the voices of the > conservatives in this forum. Platt's admiration of Ayn Rand springs to mind. > To suggest that these theories are no longer operable or that it's no longer > a problem, in my opinion, only shows that you're not paying attention or that > you don't understand how the implications of those theories continue to play > themselves out on a daily basis. > I mean, dude, you are swallowing some awful, awful stuff and apparently don't > realize how or why it's so rotten. Buy a clue, rent a hunch or something, > will you? Jeez. > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you’re up to on > Facebook. > http://windowslive.com/Campaign/SocialNetworking?ocid=PID23285::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:SI_SB_facebook:082009 > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
