Hi Horse, My interpretation of these words would be as follows: Belief requires sq, or a patterned (reified?) understanding of what is to be believed in. For example: Belief in MoQ where we do a lot of reading and empirically continually test the theories embodied in MoQ.
Faith requires no understanding, but a strong connection. Faith in MoQ would be expressed if one adopts the tenants of MoQ without needing the logic behind them as fully supporting of such adoption. That is, one would consider the levels as an adequate description without having to know the how or why of them, or wether Lila fully present such levels to our intellectual satisfaction. The same can be said about evolution. Most do not know the foundational theories that go into evolution, they simply have faith that what they learned in school is the be all, end all of why we are here. Most of Scientism is held fully on faith. I read statements in this forum concerning some theories in science expressed as if they are True. We of course usually know better. I have no problem with Belief in science, it is Faith that is often abused by politicians and other demagogues. Most of what we know now in science will be proven to be wrong. This is demonstrated through the history of science over the ages. The current string theory of the universe is a throw-back to alchemy. Equations for string theories are judged on their beauty or elegance. This has to be since these theories cannot be proven at present, and probably not for a long time to come. Since logic is something created, and therefore fallible (or always being revamped), Belief is much harder to consistently maintain than Faith. A good example would be that we exhibit Faith that the sun will rise up tomorrow. We always have even before modern astronomy (except for some who thought scientists (called priests back then) were gods. To have Belief that the sun will rise requires an intellectual understanding of how it works, and why we Believe that tomorrow will have sunshine. Most of us do not go through that, and probably do not even think about it much. In the same way, we do not all understand what an orange (for example) does biochemically in our bodies, yet we eat one anyway to stay healthy. The fleeting nature of Belief can be analogize in that we believe that certain foods disagree with our stomachs. If over time we become more tolerant of such foods, such belief will disappear. Most of our lives are based on faith. Even basic assumptions in science are accepted on faith, that is why they are called assumptions. If we were to truly believe in gravity, we would have to understand the equations that Einstein and others have developed. We just have faith the we will not suddenly lift off and fly off into the heavens. It would be interesting to make a list of those things in MoQ that we accept on faith, and those on belief if others accept my definitions herein. I do not believe this is similar to your current beliefs as expressed below; I am just providing a humble comment from somebody who does not think about these things much. Cheers, Mark On Sun, Sep 11, 2011 at 7:56 AM, Horse <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Folks > > Just had an idea wander into my mind and take up residence so I though I'd > share it. > > It occurred to me that the difference between Belief and Faith is that the > former is an intellectual POV that points to or references another level > within the MoQ (or possibly to the same level) while the latter never > references anything other than the intellectual level. > > Any thoughts? > > Horse > > -- > > "Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production > deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid." > — Frank Zappa > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
