Marsha to Andre:
I have applied it to static (conventional) quality. Do you think
concepts, or patterns, are independent?
Andre:
This doesn't really address your statement nor does it address my
questions about that statement. But, predictably you give me half of a
one-liner immediately followed up with a question.
To say:
'Hmmm, regardless of half empty/half full, static value is empty of inherent
existence and cannot be found.' you are setting up a few confusing propositions.
The first is the 'either/or' proposition (which you totally reject in other
people's posts). Yet, you've set it up. The second one is the confusion of two
different modes of enquiry you apply simultaneously as in 'static value is
empty of inherent existence and cannot be found'. To use Wilber's terminology
you are doing an 'eye of contemplation' enquiry and follow it up with a SOM
('eye of the flesh') interpretation.
Dmb states it much more eloquently than I do: 'In the MOQ, static patterns are
never supposed to be primary realities. Subjects and objects are already
reduced in rank and otherwise portrayed as secondary concepts. Static patterns
are just concepts and nobody ever thought that concepts are primary or
independent realities. This is the main problem with SOM, of course.'
This is what I wanted to tease out with you. You still, to use dmb's argument:'...confuse
the disease with the cure and ends up telling us that "static value is empty of
inherent existence and cannot be found". Thus she has used the MOQ's critique of
SOM's realism to undermine the MOQ itself. Somehow, she thinks the static patterns or the
MOQ are equivalent to SOM's conventional reality such that they can both be whipped with
the same stick. She cannot distinguish Pirsig's solution from the problem it's meant to
solve. She is, in effect, using Pirsig's critique against Pirsig.'
In other words, what is still applied here is the SOM/SOL (or some equivalent)
as intellect. This you fail to see or recognize. By not seeing this your
statement is rendered totally meaningless. It seems to me that what you have
done is use a meditative enquiry and presented a SOM/SOL interpretation of that
enquiry.
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