Nick, all, On Tue, Aug 2, 2016 at 12:38 PM, ngriffis <ngrif...@bellsouth.net> wrote: > > > Nick: Thank you, Dan, for the reference to ZMM free download. I found > that I could put in a key word/phrase and the pdf document would cite every > page where that word/phrase was to be found. This is a great way to be able > to resource information...ah! technology. When it has Quality, it is a good > thing :)
Dan: Yes, the e-version of ZMM is a delight! > > > > Mention has been made of Turner's Letter, Persig's reply letter to > Turner, and a compilation of first year Lila Squad discussions titled > "Lila's Child" > > > > Nick Question: Would anyone be kind enough to direct me to these > documents or would any one post them for new comers to access and learn > from. Thank you Dan: Paul Turner's letter was available (I thought) at www.robertpirsig.org but I can't seem to find it now. I don't seem to see it on moq.org either. I do have a copy in my files I can forward to you. As far as Lila's Child, it is available through Amazon. Or if you say pretty please I can send you an e-copy. :-) > > > > Nick: Finally, Patterns of Value has been discussed here recently. It > has been said that there is a hierarchy of patterns and that the higher > pattern of value has precedent over lower patterns: > > > >> Chapter 13 of LILA. > >>"Just as it is more moral for a > > doctor to kill a germ than a patient, so it is more moral for an idea to > > kill a society than it is for a society to kill an idea." > > > > Nick Question: Did Pirsig really say this? Dan: Yes. > This cannot be right. Much > more towards MOQ is, I believe: > > > >> "This observation is impossible in a substance-dominated metaphysics where > everything has to be an extension of matter. But now atoms and molecules are > just one of four levels of static patterns of quality and there is no > intellectual requirement that any level dominate the other three." [Robert > Pirsig] > > > > Nick: Perhaps, I have taken the germ metaphor out of context and > Pirsig does not put forward the concept that an idea killing a society is > more moral than a society killing an idea. Dan: Yes, he does put forward that concept in Lila. Ideas are at a higher level of evolution than social patterns. > > Also, I suppose that Pirsig can only give us a map to Quality. The > ideas of MOQ are just the map and that we are "finally and completely > trapped into making quality judgments for" ourselves to climb the mountains > and traverse the territory. Thank you: Dan. Dan: You are welcome. > > To conclude, I send my greetings to John and Tuukka. Tuukka, hang in > there. I wish you well and right along with you, I, too, am seeking how to > reach for greater Quality. > > Being isolated can lead to quality because it allows one to think > more deeply. Being isolated can lead to negative quality because, I believe, > it is hard-wired into our biology to be with other people. Dan: I tend to be pretty isolated. If not for that, I'd get very little accomplished so far as writing goes. That, and I don't seem to play well with others. Too, the only time I feel alone is when I am in a room full of people. > > Further, seemingly through the ages, we have come to value that > having "purpose" in our lives moves us closer to quality. Dan seems to find > this in his writing. Dan: I don't know that I'd call my writing a purpose. It is more an addiction. > I am still working on finding my purpose. I know what > it is "not" though, just as we know what is an essay that lacks quality :) > Pirsig gave us the guideline that we can know what Quality is. Charlie > Munger, a popular philosopher-business man of today, urges us to always > "invert". That is: always turn what you are thinking about to its' opposite, > to its' upside-downness. Then take a look at that possibility. That might be > an addendum guideline to seeking quality, the realization that knowing what > is "not" bringing us towards quality also can help. Here is to finding more > Quality and purpose. Dan: I see Charlie Munger is an associate of Warren Buffett. His partner, in fact, at least according to Buffett. Which isn't in itself a bad thing, but I remember being troubled by some of Buffett's investment advice concerning tobacco company stocks and how they were his preferred vehicle for profit in that tobacco companies manufactured a highly addictive product. That bothers me, more than a little, really. So his, Munger's, philosophy of ethical business practice is (to me) suspect, at least by association. On the other hand, he is a billionaire so I suppose he must be a really sharp guy. Thank you, Dan http://www.danglover.com Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html