[Platt] I'm not sure what to believe other than the highest good of all -- the freedom to investigate, acquire, hold and change beliefs. So if Case, Arlo or anybody else believes in nihilism (and I'm not sure they do) or are flexible in their beliefs, that's OK by me.
[Case] Having now been firmly slapped with the nihilist label let me recommend perhaps the finest statement of nihilism ever uttered. It was written by a Jewish philosopher sometime around 300 B.C. near the time that the middle east was conquered by Aristotle's student Alexander. It has inspired the writing of: Shakespeare, Hemmingway, Browning, Shelley, Updike, Orwell, Bradbury, Wharton, John Cougar Mellancamp and Kansas. It begins: "Vanity of vanities; all is vanity. What profit hath a man of all his labour which he taketh under the sun? One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever." Of man's special place in creation he says: "...they might see that they themselves are beasts. For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, ...All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again." He prefers life to death, sort of: "...for a living dog is better than a dead lion. For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing." At one point the author concludes: "...a man hath no better thing under the sun, than to eat, and to drink, and to be merry:" Of wealth he say: "Yea, I hated all my labour which I had taken under the sun: because I should leave it unto the man that shall be after me. And who knoweth whether he shall be a wise man or a fool?" Of wisdom and philosophy he says: "Better is a poor and a wise child than an old and foolish king..." But we warns: "And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." He see Value in wisdom but "Then I saw that wisdom excelleth folly, as far as light excelleth darkness. The wise man's eyes are in his head; but the fool walketh in darkness: and I myself perceived also that one event happeneth to them all." He sums it up this way: "As he came forth of his mother's womb, naked shall he return to go as he came, and shall take nothing of his labour, which he may carry away in his hand. And this also is a sore evil, that in all points as he came, so shall he go: and what profit hath he that hath laboured for the wind?" At yet this work of nihilism inspired Pete Seeger to put this passage to song. This is about life as pure experience. To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven: A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing; A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away; A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace. Life faced and lived realistically without pretence. Is this what you mean by nihilism? Because if so I want that sticker put dead center of the bumper, right above the license plate. To those who have tossed their Bible's in with the coffee grounds I suggest Ecclesiastes is reason enough to pull it out and look again. But I suspect the author would be indifferent to where you put him, after all what are dried coffee grounds but more dust in the wind. moq_discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
