SA, Just an aside. You are so totally cool!!!!!
m 12:58 PM 2/15/2007, you wrote: >Hello, welcome, and please do contribute Omar!!!! > > Duality does exist, as you mention. Duality is >found within static quality, as I see it. Dynamic >quality is the aspect of Quality that I also think P. >was referring to as Dao (Tao). What I also know about >Daoist philosophy, which I have incorporated into my >living philosophy and find compatible with the MoQ, is >de/te (Daodejing or Taoteching). Dao is the Way or >Way-making, the 'in-general' perspective. De is focus >or the 'particular' perspective. Amidst this whole >'general' perspective particulars exist. At least >from the philosophical explanation that I'm familiar >with (A Philosophical Translation DAO DE JING: by Ames >and Hall), these particulars can be yang-becoming-yin >or vice versa, meaning the particular expresses yang, >but this particular, though expressing yang, is still >together with yin, therefore yang is expressed in the >particular, yet, this particular is understood as >becoming yin. Particulars are never separated. Yin >and yang are never separate from each other. >Particulars express yin or yang at any given moment, >but the Way is fluid, dynamic and thus at any given >moment yin may be expressing itself from any >particular but yang is still present with the >particular. This is known, as I've stated, as >yin-becoming-yang or yang-becoming-yin, therefore, >dualistic, yes; separate, no. Not separate due to the >mother, Dao, or in the MOQ, due to Quality. >Separation suggests a gap, but their is no gap, earth >touches heaven, nothing is in-between, thus, no >separation. This is also, what I think, is meant by >the black/white yin/yang that you mentioned. How in >black a little circle of white is present and vice >versa. Yin is becoming yang and so forth. > What is currently expounded, discussed, is >dualism is separated or dualism is not separated. > One view states Yin has a gap between itself and >yang. These opposing opposites do not touch, there is >no 'becoming' as I've mentioned above. These two are >opposed, opposite, and no oneness can be >intellectualized. > Another view is that intellect can understand and >think in accord with oneness. Oneness can be >intellectualized and put into thought. > I do understand thought can not incorporate all >of reality and this is why dynamic quality exists. >For no matter how much we intellectualize, experience >socially, biologically conducted, etc... the whole of >reality is not individualized or in any one of these >particular static levels. Primary reality is dynamic >quality. > >Any thoughts? Comments? Insight? Or anything in >particular we could continue discussing based on what >you posted below and I may have left out I would be >honored to have a continual dialogue on any of these >particulars. > >thanks. > >snowy white, >SA (Spiritual Adirondack, which you'll see Heather >Perella come up as to who posted this, but she is my >wife. I just go by SA.) > >P.S. Again Welcome and any contributions would be >greatly appreciated!!! > > > > Hello, all. I just signed up, and this is my first > > post. I have often > > pondered the nature of duality, and so appreciated > > Kevin's post. I will just > > briefly sketch my thoughts, as they arose, while > > reading this thread. > > Whether a real attribute of our inner and outer > > worlds, or just a mental > > construct that facilitates our thinking about these > > worlds, DUALITY EXISTS. > > Does the MoQ strive to resolve dualistic thinking? I > > don't think that it > > strives to do so, but yet it does, in a way... > > In ZMM, P. speaks of reading the Tao Te Ching (TTC) > > and substituting the > > word "Quality" for "Tao", and that this fits > > perfectly. In The TTC, Lao Tzu > > describes the Tao as (paraphrasing and amplifying) > > the mother of heaven and > > earth; the original oneness out of which all things > > arose. Taoist philosophy > > (largely based on TTC) expands this idea in the > > following way: The Tao gives > > rise to the Tai Chi (the duality of yin and yang, > > commonly known as the > > Yin-Yang and represented by the familiar design of a > > circle, 1/2 black-1/2 > > white, divided down its center by a curving line, > > and with a dot of white in > > the black and vice versa). The Tai Chi is a > > representation the duality of > > the universe--the two equal and opposing energies of > > yin and yang; it would > > be easy to get lost in the profound truth of this > > duality and to forget that > > there is a more profound truth: The oneness from > > which this duality arose. > > The Tao. Or, if you like, Quality. Pirsig wasn't > > kidding: they really are > > interchangable! > > Kevin, as to your question about Buddhists' saying > > that "Life is Suffering", > > I believe that (from the little that I know about > > Buddhism) they are > > referring to the fact that they strive to reach > > enlightenment (Satori), but > > that the very fact that they are striving for Satori > > guarantees that they > > will never reach Satori, as to reach this state you > > have to abandon all > > desires. Since this is not possible, for us mortals, > > then all of life is a > > struggle--a suffering--to come as close to the pie > > without taking a bite. > > I was very happy to have found this forum, and will > > hopefully be > > contributing more, with the kind permission of the > > established members. > > > > Omar Canosa > > 2/14/07 > > > >____________________________________________________________________________________ >Bored stiff? Loosen up... >Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. >http://games.yahoo.com/games/front >moq_discuss mailing list >Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >Archives: >http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ moq_discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
