Case
20 Mar. you wrote:
> [Case]
> So what is it that you think is missing from these texts?
SOM or - as Pirsig says - "intellectual patterns" Have you been
asleep long?
> [Case]
> No I said that intellect was not missing from them not that intellect
> was their primary concern.
If - as Pirsig said to me - warnings about crocodiles and promises
of reward from Jahveh, is SOM-intellect then anything goes.
> [Case]
> Who said anything about sociology? My main beef with the social level
> is that by including only human society it ignores the evolutionary
> significance of social systems. A human city and a beehive are
> parallel examples of a particular survival strategy. Isolating human
> society to its own level it artificial and misleading.
I know you are busy speaking with the whole gang simultaneously
but try to read this - I delivered it to Magnus because you two
have de-railed at the social issue and sees societies all over the
place (I guesss I said something about it to you too, but who
reads long posts?) The social value level is NOT about survival
strategies and/or organization of societies. It's primary concern is
to free existence from the constraints of the biological level and
because bees, ants or apes displays no such qualities they are
not of the social LEVEL. While there is no human culture without
strong regulations/limitations on the biological aspect of
existence. For instance the Semitic religions' obsession with
sexual matters, their endless rules about food, dress codes (for
women particularly) circumcision, and general behavior. Ref. the
Torah and the said "holy texts".
> [Case]
> I will not even try to make sense out of what you are saying above but
> it seems to me that what distinguishes thought before the Greeks from
> thought after the Greeks is the application of formal reasoning. The
> Greek philosophers seem to have picked this up from the Greek
> mathematicians. But if you asked an Israelite how many sheep he had he
> could probably tell you and if you asked him how many he expected to
> have next year or how many he would have if he acquired his neighbor's
> flock he could probably tell you. He might have to go out and count
> them but it hardly seems fair to claim he has no intellectual level
> because he does not use modern techniques of addition.
Is this what you have gleaned from reading about SOM in ZMM?
No wonder you see no purpose with the static hirarchy and in the
MOQ at all. Wonder why you still are among so many nit-wits?
But for all who have seen the immense power of the DQ/SQ
divide and the static levels it plain to see that SOM is missing
from the ancient texts. The objective - scientific - attitude, no
skeptics asking for a natural explanations and claiming that the
prophetic stuff were subjective nonsense. It's plain as day.
> [Case]
> You read Lila? And you came away with this drivel? Intellect's primary
> purpose? Levels despising each other? Levels forming alliances? You
> take from your reading that the MoQ is all about the personification
> of abstractions. And you wonder why I stay away from this rubbish?
Is it my interpretation or Pirsig's presentation of the MOQ you call
drivel? If it's mine I don't mind much, coming from an anti-
MOQist its rather a badge of honor. Look at this:
It's a very complex struggle of conflicting patterns of
values. This conflict is the residue of evolution. As new
patterns evolve they come into conflict with old ones.
Each stage of evolution creates in its wake a wash of
problems. It's out of this struggle between conflicting
static patterns that the concepts of good and evil arise.
Thus, the evil of disease which the doctor is absolutely
morally committed to stop is not an evil at all within the
germ's lower static pattern of morality. The germ is
making a moral effort to stave off its own destruction by
lower-level inorganic forces of evil (LILA p.57).
I could come up with much more that support my interpretation,
but if the MOQ is rubbish to you it would be pearls before swine.
IMO
Bo
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