Hi All The topic for discussion for MAY 2000 is: I suggest that we discuss "the Giant." Cities as living entities, larger than ourselves. Not against or for us. Does the Giant have a Devouring nature? How do we relate metaphorically to the "City" as the "red blood cell" does to the body or carbon based life forms does to the inorganic level? Do you feel the pulse? Todd - Gem7th) **************************************************************************** Thirteen votes were sent in and caused a tie-breaker between Topics 1, 2 and 3. #1 (Jaap Karssenberg) David Buchanan, 3rdWaveDave, Jaap Karssenberg #2 (Marco) Gene Kofman, Bodvar, Marco #3 (Todd - Gem7th) Gem7th, Jonathan B. Marder, MIV #4 (Richard Budd) Mark Butler, Richard Budd #5 (Diana McPartlin) Diana, AtalayaLeda As the outgoing moderator with the deciding vote, my vote goes to #3. If I have made any mistakes in who voted for what, let me know. Horse ************************************************************************** The Topics were: 1) Jaap Karssenberg I want to re-suggest a topic about the place of religion and mysticism in MOQ. For if mysticism is DQ than religion is the corresponding SQ; but is there religion only on social level or also at the intellectual level? As Pirsig points out science builts on mythos in so far that it has it own dogma's. But isn't science without dogma's simply mysticism. So in short: What are the places of religion and mysticism in MOQ, and what connection is there with the place of science? 2) Marco Is it possible to be aware of something without a Subject Object Logic? 3) Gem7th (Todd) I suggest that we discuss "the Giant." Cities as living entities, larger than ourselves. Not against or for us. Does the Giant have a Devouring nature? How do we relate metaphorically to the "City" as the "red blood cell" does to the body or carbon based life forms does to the inorganic level? Do you feel the pulse? 4) Richard Budd Quote from MD list "Whether a [mental] patient can be treated against his will (very rare indeed) or whether a [mental] patient should be manipulated into accepting treatment they would otherwise reject (probably a lot less rare although very difficult to determine) are extremely problematic ethical issues. I can't see that the MoQ helps here so I will shut up." <End Quote> What would the MoQ say here? It threw me for a bit of a loop trying to work this one out--- so I propose: What does the MoQ have to say about medical ethics? --- Should we force mental patients to undergo treatments they may not want??? What about Euthanasia??? Or Cloning for spare parts.... Pirsig's (extremely unimpressive) example of the moral conflict between the doctor and the germ shows us that he believes the MoQ should be able to deduce the answers to these ethical cunundrums. Certainly the INTELLECTUAL will have something to say about what SOCIETY should and shouldn't do medically.... What do you say? 5) Diana McPartlin Challenge Phaedrus to the Book of Questions! This is a set of questions used by writers to help develop character. Most of us are probably familiar with party games based on this, but I think it can also be used to great effect as brainstorming exercise to analyse the literary character of Phaedrus. None of these questions is answered in Lila or ZMM so this forces us to go beyond the page and explore Phaedrus's personal philosophy, morality, politics, knee-jerk reactions, secret fantasies, wishes, and much more. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Book of Questions (and, just to be clear, I mean we answer all of them in one month) A. If your character were to die this evening with no opportunity to communicate with anyone, what would they most regret not having told someone? Why haven't they told them yet? B. Would your character accept $1,000,000 to leave the county and never set foot in it again? C. Your character is given the power to kill people simply by thinking of their deaths and twice repeating the word "goodbye." People would die a natural death and no one would suspect them. Are there any situations in which they would use this power? [If they can imagine themselves killing someone indirectly, could they still see doing it if they had to look into the person's eyes and stab the person to death? Have they ever genuinely wanted to kill someone or wished them dead?] D. What would constitute a "perfect" evening for your character? E. Would your character rather be extremely successful professionally and have a tolerable yet unexciting private life, or have an extremely happy private life and only a tolerable and uninspiring professional life? [Since so many people place great emphasis on a happy private life, why do people often wind up putting more energy into their professional lives? If you feel that their private life is more important to your character, do their priorities support this? Are they simply unwilling to admit that work is more important? Do they use work as a substitute? Do they hope professional success will somehow magically lead to personal happiness?] F. If your character could wake up tomorrow having gained any one ability or quality, what would it be? G. Your character has the chance to meet someone with whom they can have the most satisfying love imaginable the stuff of dreams. Sadly, they know that in six months the person will die. Knowing that pain that would follow, would they still want to meet that person and fall in love? What if they knew their lover would not die, but instead would betray them? [In love, is intensity or permanence more important to them? How much do they expect from someone who loves them? What would make them feel betrayed by their mate indifference? Dishonesty? Infidelity? H. Does your character prefer being around men or women? Do their closest friends tend to be men or women? I. Would your character be willing to murder an innocent person if it would end hunger in the world? [Would it torment them more to have the blood of an innocent person on their hands or to know they let millions of people die? What do they think of people who achieve great things by compromising their principles? Many are will to give their own lives but not to take the life of another; is anything so important they would sacrifice their very soul for it?] J. What is their most treasured memory? K. If your character knew there would be a nuclear war in one week, what would they do? L. What is the greatest accomplishment of your character's life? Is there anything they hope to do that is even better? M. One would be the one material item your character would save during a fire? N. Your character is offered $1,000,000 for the following act: before them are ten pistols only one of which is loaded. They must pick up one of the pistols, point it at their forehead, and pull the trigger. If they can walk away they do so a millionaire. Would they accept the risk? O. If your character could choose the manner of their death, what would it be? [Would they die a hero's death, die a martyr to some great cause, die in a natural catastrophe, or die peacefully? Why is it so tempting to have death catch us in our sleep?] P. For what in your character's life do they feel most grateful? Q. How forgiving is your character? R. When your character tells a story, do they often exaggerate or embellish it? If so, why? S. How much does your character feel in control of the course of their life? T. Is it easy for your character to ask for help when they need it? Will they ask for help? U. Would your character like to be famous? In what way? V. What are your character's most compulsive habits? Do they regularly struggle to break those habits? W. What does your character strive for most in their life: accomplishment, security, love, power, excitement, knowledge, or something else? X. How easily embarrassed is your character? Y. Does the fact that your character has never done something before increase or decrease its appeal to them? Z. How many different sexual partners has your character had in their life? Would they prefer to have had more or fewer? ------- End of forwarded message ------- MOQ.org - http://www.moq.org
