Hi Focs and 3WD: William Blake said, "Men forget that all deities reside within the human breast." Dave, prepare to be scolded. Without saying nasty things about your mother, I'm going to insist that you're wrong about Pirsig's Giant. In fact, I think you're twisting the MOQ in order to accomodate your personal political views, but that's psychoanalysis not philosophy, so I won't go there. Your giant just isn't Pirsig's. Check it out... from page 218 and 219 of Lila, the chapter where he talks about the Giant. Directly following the story about his sell-out frat brothers... "Phaedrus had always believed science is a search for truth. A real scientist is not supposed to sell out that goal to corporations who are searching for mere profit. Or, if he had to sell out in order to live that was nothing to be happy about. These fraternity brothers of his acted like they never heard of science as truth. Phaedurs had suddenly seen a tentacle of the Giant reaching out and he was the only one who could see it." "That was why he had run that day... He was on his way to India, done with this corporate psuedo-science, still pursuing truth, knowing that to find it he would have to get free of the Giant first." And even in Lila, as he depicts himself in New York City as an aged, famous and wealthy writer he says, "SO PHAEDRUS HAD BEEN RIGHT IN RUNNING THEN" "This was the brain center of that corporate network, surrounded by other networks; financial networks, information networks, electronic transmission networks. That's what all those tiny bodies were doing up there suspended so many hundreds of feet up in the sky. Participating int the Giant. So Phaedrus had been right in running then. But now - funny thought - ..." Sure, he finally comes back to appreciate what the Giant is all about and in the end he learns how to deal with the social level Giant without being devoured by it. But its just not the same as saying he was wrong to have ever run and free himself. He says just the opposite. He had been right in running then. And of course he's not JUST telling us his own story is he? He's telling us about how we should relate to the Giant, or at least it suggests that its likely to be a struggle for each of us in a similar way. And please notice how many times Pirsig mentions money and corporations in describing the Giant? Lots and lots. I think the similarities with Buckminster Fuller are astonishing. Check it out... He somewhat humorously described the force that runs the world as a "GRUNCH", that is a bunch of giants. It was also a kind of acronymn standing for; the Gross Universe Cash Heist. Bucky had balls, eh? He and Pirsig not only used the same image, they both paint the same sorts of intitutions as being the giant. Fuller identified them as "the corporately inter-locked owners of a vast invisible empire, including airwaves and satellites, and visible empires,,, including cluster cities around the world, factories and research laboratories." He also included "the financial credit system, with the means of initiating any world-magnitude mas-production and distribution ventures." Please notice the similarities to the quotes from Lila. And to Horse's list of particulars. Those greedy and heartless forces that oppress have been imagined as Giant ever since Gulliver's Travels. At least. It doesn't much matter what kind of social patterns are your favorites, they are still social patterns. Let le put it this way. I'll try to speak your language, sort of. There a place where I can stand to get this very cool visual perspective. I'd photograph it and work it a bit if it weren't for all the telephone poles and wires and such. Those usgly distracting lines are part of the story too, I suppose, but they'd ruin a photo. Anyway, from this spot a person can see the evolution and progression of our society. The spot lets you see a tall chuch steeple reaching up past the height of the surrounding trees. Behind that, taller and larger than the steeple is the gold dome of the State captiol building. And behind that, taller and larger still, is the nameless non-descript skyscraper which serves as a bank building in the heart of the city's financial district. From the spot, a person can see all three structures at once and they are aligned so that the upward thrust of each adds to an overall push that is .. well .. I was kind of moved. But the idea I'm trying to get you to SEE is that social patterns evolve and change. The church was once the most powerful thing going, the the government was the most powerful thing going, and now it is money and such. And none of those things ever really lost power so much as that there power was dwarfed in comparison to a new and larger power. The steeple and the dome never shrank, but they got smaller when the skyscraper went up. But my main point is just that 3WD is way wrong about the Giant. Beware the Giant. DMB MOQ.org - http://www.moq.org
